Brontoforumus Archive

Discussion Boards => High-Context Discourse => Topic started by: uoƃɹoƃoɯǝp on November 01, 2008, 03:06:24 AM

Title: Girl Power
Post by: uoƃɹoƃoɯǝp on November 01, 2008, 03:06:24 AM
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Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Niku on November 01, 2008, 06:33:07 AM
Sadako (sorry Niku).

>:|  HER REASON IS THAT SHE WAS HORRIBLY RAPED AND GIVEN A VIRULENT DISEASE AND LEFT TO DIE IN THE BOTTOM OF A WELL, SO SHE DECIDED SHE WANTED TO TAKE OVER THE FUCKING WORLD WITH HER HATRED.  THROUGH VIDEO TAPES.  EAT A SHIT AND DIE.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Classic on November 01, 2008, 06:41:30 AM
(http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb194/eidako/vs_Leeloo.jpg)
Leeloo (5th Element) =
Multipass! Leeloo was the central character of The Fifth Element. The Fifth Element is the greatest movie ever made, and by extension she should be the greatest heroine of any movie. But...not quite. Even though she's the supreme being, protector of life in the universe, she takes a backseat to Korben Dallas. She does a decent job of beating up the stupid warrior aliens, but when she ends up crying in the fetal position in an air duct even though she doesn't appear to have been shot, it makes a person wonder about just how much of a guardian she is.

I'm still disappointed that I couldn't believe what the fifth element was until 30 minutes after I'd seen the ending of that movie.

Spoilers:
Classic is retarded.
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y182/diowho/Ma-Ti.jpg)
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Kazz on November 01, 2008, 06:57:58 AM
the list requires:

Revy from Black Lagoon +
Faye Valentine from Cowboy Bebop +
Caska from Berserk +
Leela from Futurama =
Yoko from Gurren Lagann +

can't think of anyone else off the top of my head right now.

my scores:

Sarah Connor +
Ripley +
Major +
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Friday on November 01, 2008, 08:34:43 AM
the other Beatrix would be cool to see on the list, and she and Kerrigan would get my ++ as my all time favorite female badasses, though a lot of who you mentioned are good too

EDIT: oh you can only vote ++ once

great now I can't choose

I'd want to say Beatrix Kiddo gets the edge for being blonde and katanas, but Kerrigan is a fucking invisible assassin turned invisible murder death machine which kinda balances that out

ummmmm

They both have good quotable dialog

They both have awesome love interests

I -- I can't choose

 :scanners:

I will put off my final choice until I see how well done Kerrigan is in SC2
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Classic on November 01, 2008, 09:26:21 AM
They both have awesome love interests
:wat: I would never have conceived ('cuz I'm notta gurl hurr hurr) of this being a reason.
I guess I'm a little bit sexist. Sometimes.

... Fuck you Avenue Q.

Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Koah on November 01, 2008, 10:21:00 AM
Revy from Black Lagoon

(http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b85/ohakubi/hell-yeah.jpg)
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: James Edward Smith on November 01, 2008, 10:46:25 AM
San is cool any everything, but Lady Eboshi is a lot more badass. I mean, San rides wolves and is all feral wilderness childy, but Eboshi would have totally killed her when San attacked her and she pulled out that sword and dagger combo out of nowhere to defend herself. She also just looked cooler fighting like that. I'll take the iron-willed, graceful warlord over the feral, passionate tomboy any day.

Plus there's all those scenes when she's leading her army in that cool red hat and cloak outfit where someone's aways holding an umbrella for her while she orders musket volleys at charging samurai and giant animals. Did I mention she shoots the head of off a god with a fairly crude flintlock rifle?
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: JDigital on November 01, 2008, 11:09:47 AM
Revy from Black Lagoon

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=1SUvD5fhQ68
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Norondor on November 01, 2008, 11:29:25 AM
Lady Eboshi killed god because she thought that humans should be able to live their lives without having to be afraid of the things lurking in the wilderness. She ran a successful city, invented firearms, destroyed an army of samurai with them, and permanently changed the metaphysical landscape of the universe. Eboshi wins, everyone else goes home.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Brentai on November 01, 2008, 11:58:39 AM
Lady Eboshi is a character in a movie.  Athena was actually worshipped by actual Greek warriors who actually saw her as a greater warrior rather than a sex object despite being one of the most ridiculously paternalistic societies in history (she was also, literally, the patron Goddess of women's rights.  Not that that went very far, but it did mean that she got to personally kill you if you tried to rape a girl).  Really it's unfair to put Athena on the list since, although she's technically as imaginary as the rest, she had an actual presence in the real world.  Ditto Mulan in the reverse.

Valkyries too, I guess, except their duties are to escort warriors to Valhalla and, I quote, "serve drink and look after the tableware and drinking vessels."  Yep, the women are relegated to hostesses and waitresses even beyond death.  Real empowered.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Classic on November 01, 2008, 12:57:10 PM
Athena? Not doing whacky anime tropes? It seems like she turns dudes into stags or strikes them blind for peeping on her in the bath? Doesn't that count?

Also, isn't fully grown girls in full armor clothing busting out of impossible places a trope that she started?
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Brentai on November 01, 2008, 01:09:07 PM
Let's put it this way.

Queen Elizabeth.

Wins by default because the shit she did actually happened.  The rest of your examples are simply the idea of female empowerment; Elizabeth is basically proof on paper.

To a lesser extent, Mulan, because she may or may not have existed.

To a lesser extent than that, Athena, because although she obviously didn't exist, she DID have a real-world presence, in that the capitol city of an ancient powerful empire was dedicated to worship of her.

All three ought to be stricken from the running, as comparing their actual accomplishments to made-up accomplishments is totally unfair.  Those of you actually taking the latter as superior are demonstrating your desperate disconnect from reality.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: McDohl on November 01, 2008, 01:12:00 PM
in b4 cheetara
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Classic on November 01, 2008, 01:19:30 PM
I'm putting in my hat to Kuan-Yin. The bodhisattva of mercy. Her disciple beat the Monkey King pretty handily, and Old Monkey is a fucking badass. An :over9000: badass, if you will.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Classic on November 01, 2008, 01:45:50 PM
Kuan-Yin
Who? UNsource! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuan_yin)
Only 'cuz you're my new favorite madman.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Saturn on November 01, 2008, 02:22:02 PM
you guys disappoint me.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Niku on November 01, 2008, 03:28:44 PM
oh good.  I didn't realize who you were until you posted that.

(also good choice)
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: SCD on November 01, 2008, 04:19:25 PM
Ripley - ++

"Nuke em from orbit, it's the only way to be sure"

Sarah Connor - + on proper care of the M16A2

Cloud --

Beatrix -

A general is only as strong as her army.  Despite having a pretty impressive top-heavy command, the soldiers fell flat in the face of an equal force. 

Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Classic on November 01, 2008, 06:51:17 PM
Quote
Chinese goddess
I'm getting the impression that she fits in more with a healer/empath archetype than the warrior/heroine mold. If I accept her then I'll also have to put Mother Teresa on the list, and then we'll be comparing the virtues of assassins and mass murderers against that of a saint.

She is a goddamned warrior saint carrying a flaming sword with which she banishes ignorance!
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Niku on November 01, 2008, 07:02:04 PM
Well then she's nonexistant because you're still here.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: SCD on November 01, 2008, 07:11:44 PM

One ++ per player.

Edited.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Classic on November 01, 2008, 07:46:13 PM
Well then she's nonexistent because you're still here.
:smile: I get it Niku! That was a great bit of self deprecating humor there!
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Niku on November 01, 2008, 07:58:25 PM
are you mocking my french heritage.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Saturn on November 01, 2008, 08:22:39 PM
++ on gally.
+ on the Major,Revy,Chun-li and Samus
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Lady Duke on November 03, 2008, 11:50:11 AM
Sarah Connor +   
Lt. Ripley ++
Lady Eboshi -- (she makes a terrible heroine and is a coward)
The Major +
Samus +
Athena +
Haruhi Suzumiya +
Beatrix Kiddo +
Yoko +
Carmen Sandiego   =
San =
Leeloo =   
Faye Valentine - (also a coward who manipulates others into dealing with her issues)
Beatrix   +
Mulan =
Leela -
Sonya -


I would say to add Kei from Akira to the list, but god I hate how obnoxious she is.  Damn her.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: James Edward Smith on November 03, 2008, 01:55:03 PM
Lady Eboshi -- (she makes a terrible heroine and is a coward)

She's not a heroine, in fact, she's almost a villain. But in the end she is just a realistic character who has valid reasons for being mislead into doing things that are actually bad, and wrong to do.

When was she ever cowardly?
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Friday on November 03, 2008, 01:58:15 PM
i consider land mines to be automatically cowardly but maybe that's just because the united states won't agree to stop using them
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Lady Duke on November 03, 2008, 06:01:39 PM
Yeah, pretty much what Friday said.  I don't care how realistic she is, and if you find her to be realistic, she makes an even worse example of "girl power."
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: BŁge on November 03, 2008, 07:14:38 PM
How can you have a list like this and leave out Gran'ma Ben from Bone?

(http://www.comictreadmill.com/CTMBlogarchives/2007Images/sucka1001.jpg)

She fought countless monsters and soldiers, was able to keep her cool in the face of a dragon, and brought a land at war into an age of (relative) peace. And that was when she was young.

Age didn't slow her down either. It just made her tough. She's able to punch through walls, fight giant lions to a standstill and run hundreds of miles without breaking a sweat. She's also strong in the dreaming, as all of her line are. She was able to help her granddaughter Thorn realize her destiny in defeating the The Locust, eternal enemy of all living things.

Oh yeah, and she's a queen.

Come to think of it, Thorn is pretty hardcore too.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Brentai on November 03, 2008, 07:25:46 PM
Chainsaw Maid.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Rosencrantz on November 03, 2008, 07:25:52 PM
Thorn got boring once she found out her destiny, but Gran'ma Ben was always pretty cool.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Classic on November 03, 2008, 07:51:36 PM
i consider land mines to be automatically cowardly

Using explosives against monstrously huge creatures, the smallest of which are two-to-three times your mass might be an exception to that rule?
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Friday on November 03, 2008, 10:33:23 PM
Quote
Using explosives against monstrously huge creatures, the smallest of which are two-to-three times your mass might be an exception to that rule?

it does not surprise me at all in any way that you think this.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Classic on November 03, 2008, 11:10:24 PM
Somehow I am surprised that you don't justify yourself.
Why does using traps automatically make you cowardly?

Is it mines? Are you upset because the aftermath of shortsighted military policies are maiming and killing innocents?
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Friday on November 04, 2008, 06:37:28 AM
yes, the fact that mines maim and kill innocents long after the reason they were put down fades would be the primary but not only reason i don't like them
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Classic on November 04, 2008, 02:18:45 PM
Isn't that a grudge against mines, then? Would you have been OK with them if there were thousands of spring-loaded, buried spike traps?

While calling Eboshi a warrior or heroine is a bit of a stretch, she's definitely a heroic character because of what she accomplishes in spite of her relative frailty.
She's heroic because (even if she's wrong to do so) she tangles with creatures and powers that should be able to destroy her and everything she cares about without a second thought, but thanks to her efforts, iron town survives and prospers.

EDIT:
I guess what I'm saying is, none of her goals are particularly selfish, nor does she have the power to achieve those goals without using "cowardly" traps. I don't call Odysseus cowardly/unheroic because all he was able to do was blind the cyclops and flee.

EDIT EDIT: Though his goals are pretty selfish, when I think back on them.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Saturn on November 04, 2008, 02:48:20 PM
Friday would HATE playing RTS games against me.


nothing but mines, stupid distractions and indiscriminate use of super weapons.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Lady Duke on November 04, 2008, 03:22:40 PM
Killing the spirit of the forest is pretty selfish, last I heard.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Niku on November 04, 2008, 04:23:53 PM
THE FOREST HAD ITS TURN
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Brentai on November 04, 2008, 05:00:40 PM
Friday needs to play MGS.

(Psst Friday in MGS mines are automatically disabled if you crawl over them.)
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Lady Duke on November 04, 2008, 05:09:22 PM
I move that Kazz is a fatty. 

:3
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Kazz on November 04, 2008, 05:31:01 PM
 :tears:
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Alex on November 04, 2008, 05:55:44 PM
Lt. Ripley gets a + mostly because Sigourney is a great actress (whoops!) and because for having her first encounter with an xenomorph, she fucks its shit up then proceeds to give them a giant middle finger through the entire series.

Sarah Connor gets a + since she was the first of what became the generic hollywood gun toting tough empowered action woman archetype cool heroine I saw even if Terminator 2 gave me nightmares when I was a kid.

Revy scores a + because fuck fucking fucked fuckers fuck.

The Major is a + for Mary Elizabeth McGlynn, holy shit that woman's voice is amazing.

Samus gets a - because I think she's an amazingly bland character.

Xena is a + because Lucy Lawless was my waifu when I was still barely a teenager  :wuv: and got a lot of good characterization and beat up Ares by being too hot to trot.

Caska gets + because all things Berserk related are good (except for the lack of real ending in the anime).

Sasuka is a + for the aforementioned use of the bokken.

Chun-Li is a + since by Word of God (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/WordOfGod), she's still either the strongest female in Street Fighter or damn near it.

Claire Redfield earns my eternal hate and gets -- because I cannot hate her enough.  In RE2, she spends a majority of the time chasing after a little girl, ignoring everything Leon says then turning around to ask him to do things for her.  In Code Veronica, I could sum her up as BAWWWWWWWWWWW I NEED MY BIG BROTHER WHINE WHINE WHINE STEEEEEEEVE.  If it was Jill, however, I would give her the ++.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Guild on November 04, 2008, 06:07:26 PM
I like Sigourney Weaver's work in documentaries.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Guild on November 04, 2008, 06:18:58 PM
I have to give Thorn, Gran'ma Ben, Mulan, Althena, Carmen SanDiego, Lt Ripley and Beatrix Kiddo pluses.

I'm giving Sara Conner, Samus, Kerrigan and San minuses.

My double plus goes to Faye Valentine, because <3.

My double minus goes to Xena for not doing her sidekick studiously avoiding any kind of sexual encounter.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Alex on November 04, 2008, 06:23:13 PM
Wait, what?  I'm pretty sure Xena had sex with Ares a couple times.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Koah on November 04, 2008, 06:40:53 PM
Wait, what?  I'm pretty sure Xena had sex with Gabriella a couple times.

Still here, still making the bleedingly obvious jokes.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: jsnlxndrlv on November 04, 2008, 06:58:27 PM
Hello.

++
The Boss.  (God damn autoplay brings up a dead video for some reason.  Open a new tab, add "/watch?v=4qgdXLf6p1I" to the end of www.youtube.com.  Fuck.)

+
Lt. Ripley
Beatrix Kiddo
Samus (Almost voted =, but then I remembered one moment in Super Metroid that combined desperation, ferocity, and personal investment in a way that satisfied my standards.)

=
Haruhi Suzumiya
Beatrix of Alexandria
Chun-Li

-
Carmen Sandiego (Sorry, but she's a cipher.  She's notorious and good at what she does, yes, but I don't think that alone qualifies her for this list.)
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Brentai on November 04, 2008, 07:03:37 PM
Oh yeah, forgot Da Boss.  ++

Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Kayin on November 04, 2008, 07:10:58 PM
I'll give ++ To Revy, just because.. I mean, fuck, she's nuts. But if i could I'd give +++ to Balalakia instead. :3

+ To the Major.

+ To Samus as the first awesome video game female.

+ To Caska for wearing a breastplate that doesn't conform to her tits.

- To Sonya, for being in such a terrible game.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Saturn on November 04, 2008, 07:25:24 PM
Gally would be doing better if more people other than me and niku actually read Battle angel.

 :8V:
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Niku on November 04, 2008, 07:36:47 PM
i would ++ sechs except she's a man now
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Friday on November 04, 2008, 07:47:03 PM
Quote
Isn't that a grudge against mines, then? Would you have been OK with them if there were thousands of spring-loaded, buried spike traps?

no making mines low tech does not change the nature of what they are

traps which kill indiscriminately after the battle is over are not OK in my book

which by extension makes people who use them not OK in my book

so yes you are right, my grudge is against mines, technically, but the mines are inert traps that do not have the ability to lay themselves

so that would make my grudge apply to those who use them
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Brentai on November 04, 2008, 07:50:59 PM
traps which kill indiscriminately after the battle is over are not OK in my book

:ohmy: Hey, fuck you too.
:gay4: Serves ya right, ya hussy!

Quote
inert traps that do not have the ability to lay themselves

:gay4: Hey!
:ohmy: Nyah nyah.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Alex on November 04, 2008, 07:58:08 PM
Wait, what?  I'm pretty sure Xena had sex with Gabriella a couple times.

Still here, still making the bleedingly obvious jokes.

Well yeah, but she was having sex with Ares first.

But if i could I'd give +++ and a hot dicking to Balalakia instead. :3

A++ would support this.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Niku on November 04, 2008, 08:42:35 PM
Sechs is actually just a clone of Gally from Battle Angel.  So, technically, she's Gally.  Except more of a hardass.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Saturn on November 04, 2008, 08:53:49 PM
Sechs is actually just a clone of Gally from Battle Angel.  So, technically, she's Gally.  Except more of a hardass.

pic related

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v422/Mr_saturn/EXTREMEMISSILESURFING.jpg)


this is a + by the way.

also + for fio from metal slug.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: Niku on November 04, 2008, 08:57:04 PM
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v422/Mr_saturn/EXTREMEMISSILESURFING.jpg)

exactly.
Title: Re: Girl Power
Post by: LaserBeing on November 14, 2008, 01:57:59 AM
Admittedly, it's been a while since I watched Mononokehime, but all this talk about Eboshi's dishonourable use of landmines has got me wondering:

What landmines?

I don't remember that at all. Did they even have the technology for landmines? Every other explosive device they used was pretty clearly ignited by a fuse, even the super rifle. The closest thing to a "mine" that I can remember were those cinderblock bombs that they basically just dropped off a cliff.

Eboshi founded and commanded a town and its entire militia, provided a home and care for people the rest of civilisation wouldn't touch with a 10-foot pole, and stared down a god without batting an eye. She may not be particularly heroic but I'd say that's not too bad for a former prostitute. She didn't want the Shishigami's head for herself, she simply used the Emperor's decree as an opportunity to do what, in her mind, was necessary to protect her people. Let's not pretend the forest-spirits were completely innocent either.

I guess what I'm trying to say here is, to hell with Eboshi. ++ for Princess Kushana (manga version)

(http://anotherdimension.pyoko.org/kushanarampage.gif)

OH SHIT WE'RE ALL DEAD OH FUCK

(http://anotherdimension.pyoko.org/kushana.jpg)

"Do you think you can step naked into the viper's nest?"