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Author Topic: Religulous  (Read 20284 times)

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Kazz

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #40 on: October 11, 2008, 07:22:52 PM »

I think the answer ultimately lies in decreasing the power of the national government in relation to the states.  If there are states that cater to the needs of crazy people, the crazy people will flock there and stop trying to change the rest of the country quite so much.  Illegal abortion?  Great.  No gay marriage?  Super.  Keep it in Statesota.  The rest of us will go ahead and apply reason.
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Royal☭

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #41 on: October 11, 2008, 07:25:26 PM »

Kazz, our constitution expressly forbids what you're talking about.

In fact, in strict terms, since three states legally allow gay marriage, the other states are violating not just human rights, but constitutional state's rights by not legally recognizing them.  This is going to be a big issue in the coming years, and that's a good reason to have Obama putting his judges in the Supreme Court.

Kazz

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #42 on: October 11, 2008, 07:29:16 PM »

that sassafrassin'...

where's ron paul when you need him
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Thad

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #43 on: October 11, 2008, 07:42:03 PM »

I've said this many a time before, but here it goes anyway:

States' rights are important.

But individuals' rights trump states' rights.

States do not have the right to deny rights to individuals.  When they attempt to do so, it is the federal government's job to step in and force them to.

The logic you're using is, part and parcel, the same as used by the segregationists in the 1950's and 1960's.  The Executive Branch told them they could stuff it, that they had to honor the Emancipation Proclamation as interpreted by the Supreme Court.

Sure, there's no Amendment explicitly guaranteeing abortion rights or marriage rights -- but there IS one saying there doesn't HAVE to be one.  It's the Ninth.  People forget about the Ninth because it's deliberately vague, but there's precedent here.  #9 is the one the Supreme Court cited in the Griswold decision.

Now, I'm not going to hold my breath waiting for the current SCOTUS to rule that #9 also covers gay marriage.  But I'm willing to predict that we WILL see that decision within a generation.
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sei

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #44 on: October 11, 2008, 08:03:07 PM »

States do not have the right to deny rights to individuals.  When they attempt to do so, it is the federal government's job to step in and force them to.
I'm honestly not sure whether that's a joke or a typo.
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Thad

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #45 on: October 11, 2008, 08:07:13 PM »

Ha.  Freudian slip.
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Kazz

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #46 on: October 11, 2008, 08:28:11 PM »

Okay, I'll take a step further.  Give them their own tiny, tiny country.  Then maybe they won't ambush military funerals claiming that God hates America because America isn't doing a great job of rounding up the gays and killing them.

I JUST WANT RID OF THEM OK?

They're not going to change.  Just make them go away.
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sei

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #47 on: October 11, 2008, 08:57:35 PM »

Fifteen minutes after they secede, they'll be declaring war and trying to invade us anyway.
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Norondor

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #48 on: October 11, 2008, 10:32:36 PM »

Then we can kill/enslave them. Sounds good to me.
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Royal☭

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #49 on: October 12, 2008, 06:42:22 AM »

Hey, uh, didn't we do that once already?

Arc

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #50 on: October 19, 2008, 05:56:20 PM »

Caught the film yesterday.

Cannabis disciple's hair catching fire and Orlando Jesus were jaw droppers. The kid citing Episode One without a moments inflection nearly made me pee.

Needed another half hour, and not such a heavy handed closing monologue. Came off as the pure propaganda it had mocked in the previous 95 minutes.
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sei

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #51 on: October 20, 2008, 11:32:02 AM »

Minutes ago I spoke with friend Dr. Norman G. Marvin, M.D. and he is so concerned at what he has learned about Barack Obama's family in Kenya that he is calling a special prayer meeting in his home to pray against the witchcraft curses attempted by them against John McCain and Sarah Palin.

srsly
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James Edward Smith

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #52 on: October 20, 2008, 12:22:17 PM »

I was never sure if Obama was in league with the devil, evil muslims, or an evil genie. Then inJesus revealed to me the horrible truth, he's in league with all three!
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clutch

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #53 on: October 20, 2008, 12:28:36 PM »

Out of curiosity, how often do those members who are atheist or agnostic actually experience some body personally making an issue of your beliefs? I mean how often does some body try to convert you in an aggressive way?

Hoo boy. This is my favorite question when people ask me about my lack of faith.

I was already an atheist when I was sent to Catholic high school. The first year went by without much issue, but in my sophomore religion (i.e. Catholicism) class, the teacher didn't take kindly to me. She asked the class one day if there were any non-Catholics, and I, along with one of the school's few Jewish students, raised my hand. I got a funny look for that, and when I explained to the teacher that I just didn't believe in god, she told me without a trace of humor that that would make it very, very hard to pass her class. I wasn't so surprised when I started getting D's and F's on most of my assignments. I left the school after that year.

My next school was a (ostensibly) secular private school in the area with a very good reputation. They offered philosophy classes, and I took them, not realizing that I would be the only atheist in the class. Fortunately, the teachers seemed fine with me, but the students were another matter. Often, arguments I made in class were met with a response telling me that I had no morality because I'm an atheist and that my opinion didn't matter for that reason. They make a good case, am I right?

The incidents since then haven't hurt as bad because they came from idiots on the street, knuckleheads with no sway over me or my life. However, these incidents do include physical attacks. On a trip about a year and a half ago, I stopped in at a little cowboy bar outside Colorado Springs. About halfway into beer number two, I notice some guy by the pool tables giving me an ugly look. Now, every time I tell this story, somebody insists that what happened was my fault because of my tee-shirt, but I don't think that it's any more inflammatory than a "JESUS IS GOD" bumper sticker. Anyway, fast forward 45 minutes and another beer, and this same guy and his friend are following me out to the parking lot to have words. They shout curses at me and tell me that this is a godly country and (no joke) that people like me should go off to Europe where we belong. I reply that I've been to Europe and that they're not the ones that need saving. This did not have the calming effect you might expect, and the more hot-headed one took a couple lazy, drunken swings at me.

Atheists in America are the least trusted people of all. Hell, in polls, people have said they'd vote for Jew before they'd vote for an atheist, and who in history has been hated and persecuted more than they?
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TA

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #54 on: October 20, 2008, 12:56:56 PM »

Out of curiosity, how often do those members who are atheist or agnostic actually experience some body personally making an issue of your beliefs? I mean how often does some body try to convert you in an aggressive way?

I got fired for it once.  Was a shitty job, and it was in Virginia, so wasn't much point in trying to fight it.
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Do you understand how terrifying the words “vibrating strap on” are for an asexual? That’s like saying “the holocaust” to a Jew.

Kashan

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #55 on: October 20, 2008, 01:21:17 PM »

I wouldn't call the bar incident your fault Clutch, but I think the comparison you made of your shirt to an evangelical bumper sticker is a fair one. You clearly weren't looking to avoid conflict when you wore a shirt proclaiming your atheism to a cowboy bar.

School sucks when you have different religious views. I've never had a teacher like the one you described, but we did have a large southern baptist group of students who just didn't think anyone who wasn't a member of their denomination was going to heaven, and weren't shy to let you know. At the same time my nerd friends gave me shit for being religious.

The reason I asked that question initially is a few month ago I realized that I still get harassed about my religious beliefs by atheist and agnostic people I interact with on a fairly regular basis, but I've only had to deal with religious inquests a few times since graduating high-school. I was curious if maybe I was just lucky in terms of not being bothered by irate religious folk, or if my experiences actually played out with others in the community.

I'm used to it by now so I'm not inclined to complain too much. I've surrounded myself with people that have different beliefs, so it would be foolish to expect nothing to come of that.

Warning - while you were typing a new reply has been posted. You may wish to review your post.

Wow, that suck TA.
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Thad

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #56 on: October 20, 2008, 01:55:27 PM »

Clutch,

Out of curiosity, do you know why we had to get a new forum?  It's a pertinent discussion to your story.
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Classic

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #57 on: October 20, 2008, 01:59:49 PM »

agnostic people

Agnostic people tried to tell you about the supernatural?
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Kashan

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #58 on: October 20, 2008, 05:03:38 PM »

agnostic people

Agnostic people tried to tell you about the supernatural?

In that I'm apparently an idiot for having religious beliefs of any kind.
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Royal☭

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Re: Religulous
« Reply #59 on: October 20, 2008, 05:17:46 PM »

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