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[Thad]

Because there aren't enough rich white people to carry the GOP by themselves.  They need to secure the crazy vote as well.

That's the gist.  The party's relied on the evangelical vote for 40 years now; finding a new way to win elections without that large constituency is a very daunting task, and it's not going to happen right away.

[Classic]

I was hoping your the answer wasn't quite that simple, but thanks.

Also, is he right about their being a relatively low base turnout for the Republicans this cycle, and any idea what caused it?

[Bal]

McCain has never been the friend of the evangelicals.

[Thad]

Yes, but Palin is their favorite person in the whole world right now.

[Brentai]

Which is really kind of odd because, you know, woman.

[Disposable Ninja]

A woman who knows her place, though.

[Thad]

CBS: Jindal weighs in.

"Number one, we have got to stop defending the kind of spending and out-of-control spending that we would never tolerate in the other side. You know, when voters tell us that they trust Democrats more to cut their taxes [and] control spending, that tells you something is wrong with the Republican Party. We've got to match our actions with our rhetoric.

"Number two, we've got to stop defending the kinds of corruption we would rightfully criticize in the other party. The week before the election, our most senior senator is convicted on federal charges - and that's only the latest example.

"Number three, we have got to be the party that offers real solutions to the problems that American voters, American families are worried about. We don't need to abandon our conservative principles; we can't just be the 'party of no.' We need to offer real solutions on making health care more affordable, on the economic challenges facing families, on the international threats."

Jindal is one of the guys to watch.  He's young, he's a minority, and he's a popular governor -- and this proves he can make himself sound moderate when he wants to.  But the thing is, he's not -- he's far-right and part of the problem.

Essentially he's got much the same list of positives and negatives as Palin, except that he's not as dumb as she is.  I think he's a poor choice to help bring his party out of the wilderness, but he's at least paying lip service to what needs to change.

He seems to be echoing Rove's sentiments, so I'd say there are good odds this is the message the Republicans are going to start coalescing around.

[Arc]

Furthering the Jindal movement? Newt!

Gingrich... took Palin down a notch... “I think that she is going to be a significant player,” said Gingrich during an interview on CBS’s “Face the Nation”. “But she’s going to be one of 20 or 30 significant players. She’s not going to be the de facto leader.”

...

“If you want to understand healthcare, you can do a lot worse than to bring in Bobby Jindal who may well know more about health policy than any other elected official in America and is doing an extraordinary job in Louisiana.”

Gingrich/Jindal '12, book it. Yet another party elder that dumped their wife, running with a young and supposedly beloved governor, who happens to know more about _____ policy than any other elected official in America. Ho-hum.

[Thad]

Which is precisely why I DON'T think it'll happen.

Newt's gotten really good at figuring out which way the wind's blowing (a skill that would have done him some good when he wasted all his political capital).  He hinted strongly that he was going to run in '08, but backed off for the simple reason that he realized there was no way he could win.

He's waiting for his moment.  He knew this wasn't it and I think he'll realize '12 isn't it either.

[Arc]

All the signs I've seen point to Gingrich actively subverting the McCain campaign this year (with help from the Romney camp) for his 2012 run. 2016 is simply too late into the game, as he'll be older than McCain is now.

[Classic]

It's clear that I'm assuming reasonable success for the president-elect, but does Newt really have the kind of earth shattering charisma to go up against Obama as an incumbent?

[Arc]

Newt had boundless success by opposing a popular incumbent a decade ago. 2012 or bust.

[Thad]

All the signs I've seen point to Gingrich actively subverting the McCain campaign this year (with help from the Romney camp) for his 2012 run. 2016 is simply too late into the game, as he'll be older than McCain is now.

Hm, didn't realize he was that old.  Then yeah, he'll run in '12 whether it looks like a good idea or not.

It's clear that I'm assuming reasonable success for the president-elect, but does Newt really have the kind of earth shattering charisma to go up against Obama as an incumbent?

Newt had boundless success by opposing a popular incumbent a decade ago. 2012 or bust.

Arc's being glib (or has his years wrong, but I'm pretty sure he's being glib).  Newt's opposition to Clinton in '94 made his career; his opposition to him in '95 started the slow burn that destroyed it by '98.

Fresh off a rousing victory in '94, Gingrich misread the tea leaves and squandered his political capital playing a game of chicken with Clinton.  Gingrich was pushing for a budget with heavy cuts to social programs; Clinton threatened a veto.  Gingrich responded by refusing to submit a revised budget and letting parts of the federal government shut down.

This backfired, massively; it was seen for the political grandstanding it was.  Newt, of course, shot himself and his entire party in the foot by publicly stating that he was mad at Clinton for making him sit at the back of Air Force One.

Clinton got reelected in a walk and the Dems picked up 8 seats in the House (though they lost 2 in the Senate).

And then of course Newt got hit with 84 ethics charges and it was pretty much all over.

All that to say:

2012 or bust.

Republicans, PLEASE nominate this man.

(I am pretty sure they won't.)

[Romosome]

hey speaking of that guy

"I think there is a gay and secular fascism in this country that wants to impose its will on the rest of us, is prepared to use violence, to use harassment. I think it is prepared to use the government if it can get control of it. I think that it is a very dangerous threat to anybody who believes in traditional religion."

[Ted Belmont]

Wow, somebody's projecting.

[clutch]

hey speaking of that guy

"I think there is a gay and secular fascism in this country that wants to impose its will on the rest of us, is prepared to use violence, to use harassment. I think it is prepared to use the government if it can get control of it. I think that it is a very dangerous threat to anybody who believes in traditional religion."

God dammit. I sometimes like to think that the recent nosedive into fundamentalism by the Republican party is an aberration, and that as recently as a decade ago, things were better. This view was apparently a romantic one, as they were just as batshit back in the Clinton years. Maybe they hid it better back then.

[Royal☭]

The Christian fundamentalism thing has been going on since Reagan, really.


There's a lot of stuff I hate about the Republican party that can have "since Reagan" attached, really.

[Thad]

Nixon got the ball rolling.

[Norondor]

hey speaking of that guy

"I think there is a gay and secular fascism in this country that wants to impose its will on the rest of us, is prepared to use violence, to use harassment. I think it is prepared to use the government if it can get control of it. I think that it is a very dangerous threat to anybody who believes in traditional religion."

as usual he is right and i am it

[Kazz]

second