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Author Topic: Me Gridlock  (Read 5705 times)

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Thad

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Me Gridlock
« on: December 08, 2010, 02:27:56 PM »

Hey, a new thread for general complaints about Congress not doing stuff.

Anyway: WaPo: In political gamble, Reid seeks votes that are sure to fail.

My first instinct is to applaud Reid for actually daring Republicans to filibuster popular legislation and showing more spine than Obama has this week.

But then I remember the last time he did this, when he did the "You're going to filibuster?  Fine!  We'll stay here all night!" stunt, and then...went back to business as usual the next day.

Now, if he KEEPS DOING THIS, that'll be worthy of applause.  But if it's a one-time deal, fuck'im.
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BŁge

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Re: Gridlock
« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2010, 03:03:34 PM »

A thread starring Tim Roth and Tupac Shakur
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Saturn

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #2 on: December 08, 2010, 07:31:50 PM »

Supercalifragilistic-expialawacky
HONK HONK BEEP BEEP GOVERNMENT GRIDLOCK


i am very sorry but i felt this HAD to be posted

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Thad

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #3 on: December 09, 2010, 10:33:56 AM »

NYT gives the exact headline Reid was going for: Republicans Block US Health Aid for 9/11 Workers.

It's the NYT, of course, but Newsday and even the Murdoch-owned New York Post (which presumably is off-message because of that whole "New York" thing) have similar headlines.

I'm still not at all optimistic that this will have any long-term impact.  I can't remember the last time a Democrat put up a campaign ad with spooky music and lists of popular things his opponent voted against.

So the Dems score some temporary political points, nothing gets done, and at the end of the day the victims are the 9/11 first responders.  Sounds about right.
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Norondor

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #4 on: December 09, 2010, 08:50:03 PM »

I'm still not at all optimistic that this will have any long-term impact.  I can't remember the last time a Democrat put up a campaign ad with spooky music and lists of popular things his opponent voted against.

actually Jerry Brown was doing it a ton, and notably, he won. California may not be 100% doomed!
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Brentai

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #5 on: December 09, 2010, 09:28:59 PM »

On the minus side, Jerry Brown won.
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Mongrel

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #6 on: December 10, 2010, 06:08:01 AM »

It's official. We're in some kind of time warp where we will spend all of eternity being punished for the sins of our fathers.

California Uber Alles (Dead Kennedys)
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Royal☭

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #7 on: December 10, 2010, 06:21:26 AM »

Anyone else find it difficult to explain to people the irony that the people who think government is wasteful and inefficient are always the ones who make it wasteful and inefficient?  Sometimes it just makes me want to follow Superman's lead in Mongrel's signature.

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #8 on: December 10, 2010, 08:25:56 AM »

I'm still not at all optimistic that this will have any long-term impact.  I can't remember the last time a Democrat put up a campaign ad with spooky music and lists of popular things his opponent voted against.

actually Jerry Brown was doing it a ton, and notably, he won. California may not be 100% doomed!

California's like Texas, though; it's almost a country unto itself.

Anyone else find it difficult to explain to people the irony that the people who think government is wasteful and inefficient are always the ones who make it wasteful and inefficient?

I think the quote is "Republicans are people who say that government is useless, and then set out to prove it."  Something like that, anyway.
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BŁge

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #9 on: December 11, 2010, 06:27:02 AM »

It's official. We're in some kind of time warp

Well, we did do a jump to the left...
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Royal☭

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #10 on: December 11, 2010, 06:28:31 AM »

But then the whole senate just took a step to the ri-i-i-i-i-ight...

Thad

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #11 on: December 22, 2010, 12:35:55 PM »

Seeing a lot of headlines about the 9/11 first responder healthcare bill passing, most of which don't mention that they had to cut the funding by a THIRD to get the Republicans onboard.

Another victory for bipartisanship!
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Mongrel

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #12 on: December 22, 2010, 07:11:48 PM »

Globe article suggests Obama is actually doing quite well

This isn't just the globe. I've seen this view reflected in more than a few papers outside the US.

We've been howling about Obama's concessions, but on the other hand there's a cynical concession that that was probably the only way anything would have been passed barring all-out war on the floor of the Houses (leaving aside the fact that some people want that). I'll be the first to admit that we represent a certain demographic here, so it's easy to get trapped in the echo chamber. I'm wondering if the international coverage hasn't inadvertently touched on the truth. 

Now, I don't think that Obama did the best he could. He should have tried to negotiate SOMETHING, but for a very short time it LOOKS like he's racked up a mighty line of successes. Certainly, quantity does NOT equal quality and far to much was given up just to pass something (this is becoming an Obama hallmark).

But what if this actually works to his advantage? It's possible that in agreeing with him so frequently and so fast, the GOP crowd has kicked the supports out from under themselves. If Obama finds the spine for a real fight in the future, he can point out that he's cooperated for great effect - and so has the GOP - already, putting the heat on the GOP. Of course, if the GOP's smart, they can invert that. But they'll be the ones holding up legislation, so it's more difficult at least.

I don't know, I still largely sit with you guys in thinking he gave away the store and should have fought. And I certainly don't think Obama has some kind of foxy plan - if it turns out that this serves him well in the long run, it's more that his character served him well, rather than any plan.

But maybe this will actually work out better than we're crediting. Maybe we won't see the returns until his second term when (hopefully) he's less of a presidential neophyte.

At the very least he's all but assured his reelection, with so many seemingly significant bills he can point to (granted it wasn't going to be much of a fight ANYway, but...) and a supposed ability to work with everyone. That's more than enough meat to feed winning campaign ads.
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Detonator

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #13 on: December 22, 2010, 07:19:03 PM »

If Obama finds the spine for a real fight in the future, he can point out that he's cooperated for great effect - and so has the GOP - already, putting the heat on the GOP. Of course, if the GOP's smart, they can invert that. But they'll be the ones holding up legislation, so it's more difficult at least.

So the summary of this is "Obama will look better in the future if he starts doing what we've wanted him to do since the beginning".

I wouldn't call that a success until, y'know, he actually does it.
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Royal☭

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #14 on: December 22, 2010, 07:36:25 PM »

For both the Health Care debate and the Tax Cut debate, Senate Republicans were gearing up to concede that, yes, the Democrats would get what they wanted so they might as well play along.  Then Obama said the B word and suddenly they knew they could destroy both.

Mongrel

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #15 on: December 22, 2010, 07:38:00 PM »

I guess a better way of putting it would be: "Yes, Obama sacrificed lots of important things, but it possibly put him in a much better position against his opponents in the long term. This doesn't make up for what he sacrificed, but it might mean that, maybe, just maybe things aren't quite as bad as they look. Do you agree Y/N?".
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Norondor

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #16 on: December 22, 2010, 09:04:09 PM »

oh, you kooky canadians and your "hope."

i would have thought that it would be abundantly clear by now (or by day one!) that Obama sold us all down the river. He never had any intention of doing well.
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Mongrel

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #17 on: December 22, 2010, 09:07:39 PM »

I blame those Hopey-Changey posters. We're suckers for posters with bright colours and messages with no more than one syllable.
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Bal

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #18 on: December 22, 2010, 09:43:43 PM »

Man, I sure do love watching Democrats squander political capital time and time again. It's one of the few things in life of which you can be certain. Republicans will make a huge, effective stink about absolutely nothing, and Democrats will make sure no one finds out about any of their successes like knowing that unemployment is in decline will give everyone AIDS.
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Brentai

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Re: Me Gridlock
« Reply #19 on: December 22, 2010, 10:59:32 PM »

Obama doing well is only a good thing if you agree with the shit that Obama has been pulling to get people to say he's doing well.

You know Rocky Balboa was a democrat because only a democrat would consider standing up to get punched in the face some more a victory.
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