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Author Topic: Wonder Woman  (Read 13490 times)

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Thad

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #100 on: June 30, 2010, 09:31:46 PM »

Wonder Woman thread's over here, assholes.

Anyway: I'm pretty much in the "don't love it, don't hate it, jacket is stupid" camp.  I tend to like JMS, Spider-Man notwithstanding; Superman #700 mostly sucked so I wasn't expecting to plunk down $5 for Wonder Woman but it got good reviews and this was a slow week so I bought it.  Haven't read it yet.
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Mothra

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #101 on: July 01, 2010, 06:39:19 AM »

DC is so fossilized Wonder Woman needs a retcon just to change clothes.

Wait, seriously?

Amazingg~
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Disposable Ninja

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #102 on: July 01, 2010, 01:22:34 PM »

You know who had a really badass Wonder Woman costume? Donna Troy One Year Later. Circe was also Wonder Woman for an issue or two. She looked pretty badass in those.
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Thad

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #103 on: July 01, 2010, 04:22:50 PM »

Yeah, not crazy about the origin retcon either, but of course we all know they'll eventually retcon the retcon.
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James Edward Smith

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #104 on: July 01, 2010, 05:15:53 PM »

I'm pretty sure Wonderwoman's costume looks like something late 80s early 90s because that's what's in now in fashion in general, not because of some discussion at the design table.

I mean, go to any trendy bar or club and you'll probably see a scene chick dressed just like that minus the wrist bracers and possibly minus the Wonderwoman symbol.

I'll excuse a thread full of comic book nerds for not understanding this though.
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Royal☭

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #105 on: July 01, 2010, 05:40:25 PM »

Is it really a retcon when the entire point of it is that this is a temporary story?  Or is there some further retcon I'm not hearing about?

Royal☭

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #106 on: July 01, 2010, 05:41:24 PM »

I mean, go to any trendy bar or club and you'll probably see a scene chick dressed just like that minus the wrist bracers and possibly minus the Wonderwoman symbol.

And I'll guess I'll just have to forgive some trendy motherfucka' like yourself for not being all up on the latest fashions for crime-bustin'.  She ain't going to no disco, she's going to crime alley.

Esperath

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #107 on: July 01, 2010, 06:53:38 PM »

Don't worry, FOX News is on the story!  The new Wonder Woman is anti-American!
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Mongrel

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #108 on: July 01, 2010, 09:32:04 PM »

I'm pretty sure Wonderwoman's costume looks like something late 80s early 90s because that's what's in now in fashion in general, not because of some discussion at the design table.

I mean, go to any trendy bar or club and you'll probably see a scene chick dressed just like that minus the wrist bracers and possibly minus the Wonderwoman symbol.

I'll excuse a thread full of comic book nerds for not understanding this though.

I've posted about fashion elsewhere. Yeah, I picked up on that.

The problem is that mid-to-late 80's/early 90's fashions are sill stupid and ridiculous no matter how many layers of nostalgia glasses you wear (or don't wear, as the case might be for the young kids).
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Thad

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #109 on: July 01, 2010, 09:35:06 PM »

I'm pretty sure Wonderwoman's costume looks like something late 80s early 90s because that's what's in now in fashion in general, not because of some discussion at the design table.

I'm pretty sure it's because it's fucking Jim Lee.
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Thad

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #110 on: July 02, 2010, 09:24:34 PM »

Yeah, not crazy about the origin retcon either, but of course we all know they'll eventually retcon the retcon.

They're actually not insulting our intelligence by pretending otherwise, either; the premise from the outset is that things aren't the way they're supposed to be (and, by implication, she'll need to change them back).

Actually a bit of wink-and-nod meta in that the gods actually SAY that the entire reason they're doing it is that Wonder Woman is special but doesn't get enough recognition.

#600 as a whole isn't half-bad; not as good as Batman #700 but a damn sight better than Superman #700.  The highlight, as anyone who knows who Amanda Conner is will already know without even having to open up the issue, is Amanda Conner's story.  It has Power Girl.  Making jokes about tentacle rape.

The new costume's only in the last story.  It works all right in action, but the whole idea that it's less exploitative than the swimsuit version is just silly in light of all the gratuitous T&A shots.

And then there's an afterword where JMS and Lee defend changing the costume.  JMS actually claims, apparently with a straight face, that Superman has had repeated and substantial changes to his costume over the years.
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Catloaf

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #111 on: July 02, 2010, 10:03:19 PM »

Well, I don't like the jacket, but I do like it better than her original design and the designs directly derived from it.

Man her original creator was obvious about his fetishes......
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Kashan

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #112 on: July 03, 2010, 04:42:28 AM »

Well, I don't like the jacket, but I do like it better than her original design and the designs directly derived from it.

Man her original creator was obvious about his fetishes......

It's interesting to me that the two comic creators who arguably most advanced the place of female characters in super hero comics, Chris Claremont and William Marston, where both female domination fetishists. I mean it makes sense when you consider it, but it's still kind of weird to know that's the source.
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Büge

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #113 on: July 03, 2010, 07:08:17 AM »



Mmmmm, tangly bits.
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Royal☭

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #114 on: July 03, 2010, 10:01:00 AM »

The interesting thing about Marston is that people always point out his desire for female sexual dominance while at the same time keeping two subservient wives.

What's always gotten me about the Wonder Woman costume is that even when it has a skirt it looks ridiculous, and I still have no idea what the top piece is supposed to be.  If it's armor it's really form fitting armor that still does nothing to protect her vitals, and if it's just a tube top with like an eagle or W on it it's still worthless.

Catloaf

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #115 on: July 03, 2010, 10:48:06 AM »

The interesting thing about Marston is that people always point out his desire for female sexual dominance while at the same time keeping two subservient wives.

I suppose it might be more of a turn on to put a powerful woman into subservience, or be overpowered by a once subservient woman.  Either way, writing such comics gave him an excuse to think of such things.
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Royal☭

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #116 on: July 03, 2010, 10:52:13 AM »

Also I think his sexuality in the comics is over emphasized.  While it's easy to look back on such bondage as sexual, at the time it didn't have such a public bent.  What's more an insight into Marston's character is his obsession with finding the truth about things.  It's no coincidence that the person who created Wonder Woman with a truth-telling lasso also created the lie detector.

TA

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #117 on: July 03, 2010, 12:31:18 PM »

Wonder Woman's new costume.

It's cool that they're finally giving her pants, but that tiny jacket is pure 90s.

Honestly I'm only interested in this to see how Wonderella parodies it.

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Thad

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #118 on: July 03, 2010, 08:05:12 PM »

Also I think his sexuality in the comics is over emphasized.  While it's easy to look back on such bondage as sexual, at the time it didn't have such a public bent.

Marston was a psychologist who Hollywood hired to sneak titillating material past the Hays Commission.  National hired him later for precisely the same reason.  That's exactly what he was doing.  He had a pretty strong fetish for female dominance, lesbianism, and bondage, and it's hardly a coincidence that he put that kind of imagery in Wonder Woman.

There are plenty of cases where Wertham read too much into perfectly innocent comics, but Wonder Woman wasn't one of them.  He got that one perfectly right.
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Büge

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #119 on: July 04, 2010, 06:49:01 AM »

Found it!

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