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Author Topic: Wonder Woman  (Read 13492 times)

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Rico

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #40 on: August 07, 2008, 10:17:38 AM »

but no more starting from scratch.

I think the problem isn't so much that they've started from scratch too often, but that they've never actually done it.
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Brentai

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #41 on: August 07, 2008, 10:43:56 AM »

Because you'd invariably fuck shit up if you did that.

Superman's the son of Jor-El, sent from Krypton when it blowed up, raised by the Kents in Smallville, works for the Daily Planet in Metropolis, and wants to break Lois Lane in half with his super-cock.  This is all set in stone.  You can't change it.  Ever.

Whether Brainiac blew up Krypton, whether Clark Kent ever had a Kryptonian dog when he was a kid, whether there's another chick with an oddly similar name that Superman wants to bang - these are variables.  You can accept or ignore them.  Just set it as a ground rule in the beginning that you're recognizing THIS continuity and you're good to go.

A full-on reset would require that you either change the base - which is BAD and WRONG and you will not get away with it - or write the base again, which is boring.  Thad's right, you almost have to ignore bits of continuity in order to write a workable story, but that's as far as you can go.

Of course this brings us back to Wonder Woman - what's her base?  She has some sort of hazy connection to Greek mythology, and she's got some pretty goofy powers that are well-known but hardly necessary.  There isn't anything about her that you can't change without screwing it up.  Wonder Woman being just another powerful Amazon woman who wandered out of her tribe with no connection to mythology whatsoever?  Sure (although you might need to explain why she's so white).  Wonder Woman without the bullet-deflecting bracelets, or the truth lasso, or the invisible airplane?  That's all silly, you can get rid of that.  Wonder Woman without the sloganized bra and star-studded underpants?  Sure, go ahead.  She may as well be a really strong blonde chick in street clothes.  Or a bitchy woman in a french maid costume who fights with her shoes.
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MarsDragon

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #42 on: August 07, 2008, 12:35:07 PM »

I don't know, I'd argue that the the Amazon background, no matter what that background is, is pretty hard to change without making the character not Wonder Woman anymore. And even if WW's powers are fairly hazy, the costume, bracelets, and lasso are recognizable and important enough that they'd also be hard to get rid of without making her not really Wonder Woman. Think of Superman without his super strength, flight (yes I know he couldn't fly in the very earliest issues shut up), or invulnerability. Making Wonder Woman just some strong blonde chick in street clothes makes her not Wonder Woman, just like making Superman a really strong and dumb guy in a blue costume would make him not Superman, no matter where he came from.
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Brentai

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #43 on: August 07, 2008, 12:55:53 PM »

...nice turnaround, there.
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Royal☭

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #44 on: August 07, 2008, 12:58:11 PM »

...just like making Superman a really strong and dumb guy in a blue costume would make him not Superman, no matter where he came from.

That would just make him Bizarro.

Thad

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #45 on: August 07, 2008, 02:27:38 PM »

I don't think any Crisis has ever said anything more about Wonder Woman than just retconning her involvement in WWII.

Well, it's not just WWII, it's the chronology of when she left the island in general.  She was a founding member of the JLA, then she wasn't, now she was again.
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Bal

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #46 on: August 07, 2008, 02:28:35 PM »

For the record. Wonder Woman's Amazon/Greek background was based on the idea that, as the originators of Democracy, they would be interested in defending the modern bastion of Democracy. America of course. Diana herself snuck into the competition to determine the champion they would send to fight in WWII against her mother's wishes, proceeds to win, obviously, and we're off. The whole thing was very obscure and high concept, which is quite probably why she lacks the essential, simple concept that make Batman and Superman such great archetypes. You don't have to explain their origins in more than a phrase and the audience, any audience, can immediately identify. With Wonder Woman? Not so much.
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Brentai

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #47 on: August 07, 2008, 05:00:04 PM »

Wonder Woman's parents sisters were murdered by criminals misogynists.

Now she dresses up like a bat.

...in the bedroom.
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Rico

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #48 on: August 07, 2008, 09:35:44 PM »

Because you'd invariably fuck shit up if you did that.

Not quite what I meant; I could've been much clearer.

I was talking about the whole, "THIS IS IT WE'RE FINALLY GETTING RID OF THE MULTIVERSE JUST KIDDING," that happens every Crisis.
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Brentai

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #49 on: August 07, 2008, 10:41:16 PM »

Because you'd invariably fuck shit up if you did that.
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Royal☭

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #50 on: August 28, 2008, 09:53:33 AM »

Original Wonder Woman pilot from the 60s:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tKZJVhn7M4

I think ABC produced this one, hoping to capitalize on the success of Batman.  It was terrible, and rightly shot down.  That's the whole thing there.

Sharkey

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #51 on: August 28, 2008, 01:20:09 PM »

Also, didn't they originally cast some blond tennis player in the pilot of the other show, before they got Linda Carter and did it slightly less stupid?
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Royal☭

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #52 on: August 28, 2008, 02:05:23 PM »

That was a separate TV movie that totally sucked.  It was the original idea for a pilot, but it was passed over for a full series because it totally sucked.  Also, the actress who played her wasn't a tennis player, but she was a scientologist.

Guild

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #53 on: August 28, 2008, 02:58:41 PM »

Uhuhuhuhu, "wood."
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Arc

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #54 on: August 28, 2008, 03:00:26 PM »

Quote
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wonder_Woman_(TV_series)#Wonder_Woman_.281974.29



Wonder Woman's first appearance in live-action television was a television movie made in 1974 for ABC. Written by John D. F. Black, the film, a pilot prepared for the 1974 television season, resembles the Wonder Woman of the "I Ching period." Wonder Woman (Cathy Lee Crosby) did not wear the comic book costume, demonstrated no superhuman abilities and her "secret identity" of Diana Prince was not all that secret. The film follows Wonder Woman, assistant to government agent Steve Trevor (Kaz Garas) as she pursues a villain named Abner Smith (Ricardo Montalban) [sweeet] who has stolen a set of code books containing classified information about U.S. government field agents.
Quote
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cathy_Lee_Crosby

Born in Los Angeles, California, Crosby is the daughter of announcer Lou Crosby and actress Linda Hayes. Crosby was, at one time, a professional tennis player.
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Sharkey

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #55 on: August 28, 2008, 03:40:11 PM »

Contantine fucking pizzowned.

But seriously, between this and a half a million other conversations I've observed across the vastness of the nettertubes, there's obviously a weirdly renewed Wonder Woman enthusiasm.

There's a part of my brain that just wants to chalk this up to Badder-Meinhof phenomenon resulting from my recent attachment to a hot, bondage-happy woman who happens to look a lot like Linda Carter. Were I a little more weak willed it would only help my downward spiral into solipsism. Recent reading of Accelerando doesn't help much either, for that matter.

But discarding both of those crazytown possibilities, it seems like there's an astounding and recent amount of giveafuck regarding Wonder Woman. Is it fueled by the fact that she's one of the few high profile old skool comic heroes to remain unexploited by a Hollywood blockbuster, or maybe the recent coming-of-age of men who went through their sexual awakening watching Linda Carter, or is it something else?

Undercurrents of infantile wish fulfillment combined with nascent protoantifeminism and superhero deconstruction. File for later consideration.
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Thad

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #56 on: August 28, 2008, 07:02:46 PM »

Is it fueled by the fact that she's one of the few high profile old skool comic heroes to remain unexploited by a Hollywood blockbuster

Pretty much.  In fact, I'd say she's the highest-profile and most-oldschool (though Captain America's up there).
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Sharkey

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #57 on: August 28, 2008, 08:05:20 PM »

Captain America is dead.

You could do it, but it'd have to be the most cynical, awful modern take on the subject. Hilarious, but nobody would watch the fucking thing. And by nobody I mean everyone but the people who pay for movie tickets to escape from how much life sucks. Not the people who give a twisting shit.

i.e. Fucking huge in Europe.
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Bongo Bill

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #58 on: August 28, 2008, 09:32:00 PM »

I'd have to agree that Captain America-Is-Dead would be a more likely hit abroad, yes.
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...but is it art?

Rosencrantz

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Re: Wonder Woman
« Reply #59 on: August 28, 2008, 09:39:13 PM »

My friend and I can vouch for movies (or what-have-you) based on dead guys.
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