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[Brentai]

KRAKEN CLUB KRAKEN CLUB

[A²]

How do you define a 'legit' kill, Paco.

[sei]

I think something had "Octo" in it's name.

Octogenarian, with the rage of a thousand Yamauchi.

[Doom]

How do you define a 'legit' kill, Paco.

Here's a hint: Not like that.

[A²]

How do you define a 'legit' kill, Paco.

Here's a hint: Not like that.

How? To me, that's a legit kill. No glitches were used that did things outside of what was intended. Job A, used Abilities B & C, and Weapon D. That is what I see. Nothing about getting it caught behind a wall, or glitching it so it turns around and gets stuck in the ground, or anything like that.

[Doom]

Job A, used Abilities B & C, and Weapon D no longer cause X where X = something important

I fink dat when dey nerf it, dat'z da end o' dat.

[McFrugal]

I think the problem was that Souleater did that bonus damage on each hit, not each attack, so Kraken Club could do utterly ridiculous amounts of damage.  Blood Weapon then removed the negative side effect of Souleater, PLUS it made the DKs practically invincible with all the health they were healing.

40 guys doing huge damage and not dying?  That's a broken gameplay mechanic.  May as well be a glitch.

[Rosencrantz]

Oh yeah, the last FFXI apparently introduced a level-synch feature that lets you "level down" to anyone's level so you can party with them and gain EXP. It even adjusts your equipment automatically, so you don't have to swap gear. I think that's actually a cool feature that should be introduced in more games, but then I'm not much of an MMO player.

[Kashan]

My room mate is actually part of the guild that downed AV. I saw him do it the first time, though I didn't really know what was going on. I am going to have to say that if they didn't glitch it then it's legitimate, and they didn't. They gave AV a shit ton of armor now though so he takes basically no damage from physical attacks apparently.

Personally I'd be pissed if I sank the money for the kraken club to kill AV and then SE updated it to make that tactic not work anymore just because they didn't like it.

[Brentai]

You could avoid a lot of this argument by just saying "killed without Kraken Club" instead of "legitimate kill."  Having a particularly unstoppable strategy isn't cheating so much as breaking the game, and your personal opinion on doing so may vary.  See also Uber Medics.  ...or AWP Faggotry, or Spawn Camping, or Zerg Rushing, or Shinespiking, or every other powerful technique in the history of online gaming.

[Envy]

Hey guys we used tanks! Oh my god they reduce damage. Thats not a legitimate kill unless you dont use tanks. If its in the game its legitimate. Using aspects of the game to your advantage is part of the game. Hell if using gamebreaking tactics that players worked together and put together whats the point of playing a mmo.

[Doom]

I won't deny that nine times out of ten, dev decisions in any online game are as much a product of the occult and star-gazing as they are any sort of logic, but...

Guild does X, X is removed from the game immediately isn't a terribly hard leap of logic to follow.

[Pacobird]

My room mate is actually part of the guild that downed AV. I saw him do it the first time, though I didn't really know what was going on. I am going to have to say that if they didn't glitch it then it's legitimate, and they didn't. They gave AV a shit ton of armor now though so he takes basically no damage from physical attacks apparently.

Personally I'd be pissed if I sank the money for the kraken club to kill AV and then SE updated it to make that tactic not work anymore just because they didn't like it.

It's not like he's not getting any mileage out of his K Club.

I don't think you guys are getting it.  A tactic that turns a 45 minute fight (like, say, Bahamut v. 2) into a 45 second fight is broken, but if that seems legitimate to you, allow me to direct you to Hello Kitty Island Adventure or another MMO that might be more your speed.  Most people are happy they didn't nerf KCDRK completely.  I'm not saying a look down on KCDRKs or whatever because it's not like  somebody wanting to completely trivialize content in a video game makes my monocle pop, but at the same time it's not like this nerf was unjustifiable.

[Envy]

Also do they just plan on releasing more jobs that fail, and not increase the job levels? WoW is up to 80 come the expansion, and im sure WAR is increasing past 40 soon.. I think thats the cap i havent dumped alot of time into it yet.

[Kashan]

My room mate is actually part of the guild that downed AV. I saw him do it the first time, though I didn't really know what was going on. I am going to have to say that if they didn't glitch it then it's legitimate, and they didn't. They gave AV a shit ton of armor now though so he takes basically no damage from physical attacks apparently.

Personally I'd be pissed if I sank the money for the kraken club to kill AV and then SE updated it to make that tactic not work anymore just because they didn't like it.

It's not like he's not getting any mileage out of his K Club.

I don't think you guys are getting it.  A tactic that turns a 45 minute fight (like, say, Bahamut v. 2) into a 45 second fight is broken, but if that seems legitimate to you, allow me to direct you to Hello kitty Island Adevnture or another MMO that might be more your speed.  Most people are happy they didn't nerf KCDRK completely.

He actually didn't buy one. And yeah they shouldn't make it a 45 second fight, but I'd say that speaks to the poor design of the game. If they don't won't people to beat it by straight up breaking the game then they should make it something that can be beaten otherwise.

I just don't see the point of having bosses in a game that you don't want killed, but which aren't invincible. Either make it a legitimate goal or don't. This is especially bad in light of the fact that SE supposedly beats every boss before releasing it into the game.

[Doom]

My room mate is actually part of the guild that downed AV. I saw him do it the first time, though I didn't really know what was going on. I am going to have to say that if they didn't glitch it then it's legitimate, and they didn't. They gave AV a shit ton of armor now though so he takes basically no damage from physical attacks apparently.

Personally I'd be pissed if I sank the money for the kraken club to kill AV and then SE updated it to make that tactic not work anymore just because they didn't like it.

It's not like he's not getting any mileage out of his K Club.

I don't think you guys are getting it.  A tactic that turns a 45 minute fight (like, say, Bahamut v. 2) into a 45 second fight is broken, but if that seems legitimate to you, allow me to direct you to Hello Kitty Island Adventure or another MMO that might be more your speed.  Most people are happy they didn't nerf KCDRK completely.  I'm not saying a look down on KCDRKs or whatever because it's not like  somebody wanting to completely trivialize content in a video game makes my monocle pop, but at the same time it's not like this nerf was unjustifiable.

Look pal I rolled Night Elf Hunter to take advantage of a game mechanic, I've done nothing wrong here.

[Pacobird]

I hope they never increase the job level. While I think it would help mages of all stripes by giving them access to Convert, it means old content becomes irrelevant.  one of the best parts about FFXI is that the gear from Tu'lia, a raid zone that's been in the game for 5 years, are atill viable and in fact are in some cases still best-in-slot.  Every time WoW bumps the level cap, an entire expansion's worth of content becomes irrelevant.  Fuck a lot of that, I say.

PS: Jobs that fail?  BLU, COR, DNC, and SCH are all amazing and PUP, while not that great for group stuff, is an extremely strong soloer and is treated as such.  The only classes in the game I would honestly say are not very good are DRK (which at the very least has Kraken Club retardation) and THF (which is still sought after for endgame solely on the basis of Treasure Hunter).

EDIT: WHM has problems at 75, but that's another story.

[Pacobird]

My room mate is actually part of the guild that downed AV. I saw him do it the first time, though I didn't really know what was going on. I am going to have to say that if they didn't glitch it then it's legitimate, and they didn't. They gave AV a shit ton of armor now though so he takes basically no damage from physical attacks apparently.

Personally I'd be pissed if I sank the money for the kraken club to kill AV and then SE updated it to make that tactic not work anymore just because they didn't like it.

It's not like he's not getting any mileage out of his K Club.

I don't think you guys are getting it.  A tactic that turns a 45 minute fight (like, say, Bahamut v. 2) into a 45 second fight is broken, but if that seems legitimate to you, allow me to direct you to Hello kitty Island Adevnture or another MMO that might be more your speed.  Most people are happy they didn't nerf KCDRK completely.

He actually didn't buy one. And yeah they shouldn't make it a 45 second fight, but I'd say that speaks to the poor design of the game. If they don't won't people to beat it by straight up breaking the game then they should make it something that can be beaten otherwise.

I just don't see the point of having bosses in a game that you don't want killed, but which aren't invincible. Either make it a legitimate goal or don't. This is especially bad in light of the fact that SE supposedly beats every boss before releasing it into the game.

See earlier post re: AV is a joke and nobody legitimately tries him.  Not making excuses for it but it's one.  fucking.  mob.

[Brentai]

Does killing the damn thing get you ANYTHING but bragging rights?  You're acting incredibly butthurt that a bunch of people got an unimpressive kill that gained them no edge over anyone else.

Using the KC on everything else to gain XP, that's a problem, but only because there's a roomful of people out there whose job it is to keep players from shooting right past everyone else in terms of power.  I know them.  They're extremely frustrated.

[Pacobird]

Does killing the damn thing get you ANYTHING but bragging rights?  You're acting incredibly butthurt that a bunch of people got an unimpressive kill that gained them no edge over anyone else.

I don't know if this is directed at me or not, but I'm just explaining the mechanics of the trick and pointing out that its fucking retarded.  Are you saying it's not?

FTR, AV drops a LOT of loot (7 drops a kill), though, so in a game like FFXI where loot drops are famously unreliable, it was almost gamebreaking.

Using the KC on everything else to gain XP, that's a problem, but only because there's a roomful of people out there whose job it is to keep players from shooting right past everyone else in terms of power.  I know them.  They're extremely frustrated.

Blood Weapon is a two hour ability. Doing a KC Souleater without it kills you immediately.  It's not for XP.  But at any rate, I totallyagree.  The mechanics of Souleater beg for this kind of exploit but honestly DRKs are so weak in endgame that it's hard to tell them they can't have the one thing that makes them desirable.