Topic: Webcomics that aren't MSPA (Read 122858 times)

Brentai · « **Reply #280 on:** November 15, 2008, 08:09:35 PM »

You seriously don't understand? Fine. Lesson time.

Constantine says, "I don't like that the main character never reacts to anything. She should show a normal level of surprise."
You say, "Why should she show a higher than normal level of surprise?"

That's the very definition of Strawman Argument: to present your opponent's views as more extreme than they really are. Not that I necessarily agree with Constantine (I manage to care less the longer this discussion goes on) but when I see four different responses using the same brand of bullshit and Thad's not around to abuse the emoticon, I have to say something.

Cthulhu-chan · « **Reply #281 on:** November 15, 2008, 08:21:57 PM »

I suppose I chose the wrong wording, however my point was she shouldn't be particularly shocked at the goings on of Gunnerkrigg because she grew up with weird shit to begin with.

Mongrel · « **Reply #282 on:** November 15, 2008, 08:40:08 PM »

Perhaps, but an extremely basic rule of creative work is that contrast is important.

Every character who is in some way recognisable as a character will have some things that shock them. Or problems beyond their abilities. An extreme is fine, so long as you have something to show how extreme that extreme is. Similarly, you can paint a picture of a giant robot, the biggest robot ever, but without people or buildings or XBoxes or something to denote scale, it's meaningless. It doesn't matter if the creator's logic is that "This robot is so fucking huge that at this scale the rest of the universe is just a bland homogenous mass", because this story or artwork or whatever is still intended for consumption by us and unless our primitive monkey brains see those tiny little birds, or spaceships or whatever, we have no frame of reference. Without a frame of reference, the work is meaningless... perhaps a Superman comic circa 1966.

When a writer or artist fails to meet this basic rule all you're ever going to get is a big pile of fail.

Bongo Bill · « **Reply #283 on:** November 15, 2008, 09:38:37 PM »

I think that "a big pile of fail" is a pretty harsh way to put it. I like reading about a character who is capable of remaining calm. And it's not as if it's just that she's never surprised. She's established to be an extremely phlegmatic individual in all circumstances. She had difficulty enjoying a class with Doctor Disaster. That she keeps her cool under most circumstances is one of the reasons I find her an entertaining character to read.

There's an entire ensemble of supporting characters who, between them, are more than capable of establishing how large and surprising the robots are in relation to the skyscrapers. It shouldn't just fall to the main character to do that, and in this case it doesn't.

Classic · « **Reply #284 on:** November 15, 2008, 09:58:07 PM »

So making a story about an average joe thrust into a magical world beyond his ken isn't the only kind of fantasy story there is?

The core cast does not have to be surprised about things that the reader will be surprised by? You do not need a character to be surprised along with the readers?

Brentai · « **Reply #285 on:** November 15, 2008, 10:07:02 PM »

There's nothing wrong with an unflappable character (THE UNSTOPPABLE HIGGS!!!... except in the end he always loses it). I just personally find this Antimony chick a little boring. Mainly because she has a permanent uninterested expression plastered to her face, and it makes it hard to care about what's going on when the main character doesn't seem to.

Classic · « **Reply #286 on:** November 15, 2008, 10:10:04 PM »

Hints throughout the series suggest you'd detest a story about her father even more. Maybe that's where she gets it from?

I guess I'm willing to count what I should interpret as being half-lidded as just having eyes that are most comfortable half-sealed. My eyes can be like that, and so can a fair number of my family members's.
I was often told I looked very high throughout most of pre-real-school.

Zaratustra · « **Reply #287 on:** November 15, 2008, 10:14:52 PM »

profoundly

Zaratustra · « **Reply #288 on:** November 15, 2008, 10:14:58 PM »

mentally

Zaratustra · « **Reply #289 on:** November 15, 2008, 10:15:03 PM »

retarded

Mongrel · « **Reply #290 on:** November 16, 2008, 06:10:38 AM »

Anytime a character or plot must be defended in arguments outside the story, it is an indication - on some level - of a failure on the part of the author.

It's like all the people making arguments about how such-and-such in the Star Wars prequels wasn't badly written, oh no, that was The Will Of The Force it simply had to happen that way.

The problem with such assertions is that they are pure conjecture AND a gross violation of Occam's razor. The absence of anything to contradict these 'defenses of the author' does not make them true. Sometimes you really are reading something trashy. Admit you enjoy it and move on. Or, conversely, stop pretending it's well-written if it isn't.

Anyway, in the few strips I've seen, she doesn't seem so much 'inflappable' as, 'drawn with the same face in every panel'.

Büge · « **Reply #291 on:** November 16, 2008, 06:15:07 AM »

Quote from: Classic Is So Funny on November 15, 2008, 10:10:04 PM

I guess I'm willing to count what I should interpret as being half-lidded as just having eyes that are most comfortable half-sealed.

Royal☭ · « **Reply #292 on:** November 16, 2008, 07:13:38 AM »

Here's an exercise for Gunnerkrigg's Court: Read through the strips and remove all of Antimony's dialogue. Realize that suddenly she's become Gordon Freeman.

Zaratustra · « **Reply #293 on:** November 16, 2008, 08:40:28 AM »

Quote from: Iron_Mongrel on November 16, 2008, 06:10:38 AM

Anytime a character or plot must be defended in arguments outside the story, it is an indication - on some level - of a failure on the part of the author.

Whenever someone disagrees with me, it proves my point.

Brentai · « **Reply #294 on:** November 16, 2008, 09:23:42 AM »

when you start echoing a specific tenet of guildenstern you really need to take a good long look in the mirror and try to pinpoint the exact moment you became really fat

Mongrel · « **Reply #295 on:** November 16, 2008, 09:53:02 AM »

Seriously guys, I'd like to think that we can agree that Randomname Court ain't no Watchmen. Hell, it's no third-string X-title.

But if you want to call out what's-his-face as an up-and-coming Neil Gaiman, hey, be my guest. I'm not here to police your tastes.

Classic · « **Reply #296 on:** November 17, 2008, 12:54:14 AM »

Come to think of it, almost everything I read would probably do better consumed in larger samples.

Cthulhu-chan · « **Reply #297 on:** November 17, 2008, 05:31:37 AM »

Things are afoot in Horribleville.

Mongrel · « **Reply #298 on:** November 17, 2008, 05:47:51 AM »

KATE BEEEEEEAAAAAAAAATTTTTTTTOOOOOOOOONNNNNNNNNNNNNN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

_{I know it's just a guest appearance/joke, but still.}

Guild · « **Reply #299 on:** November 17, 2008, 11:23:53 AM »

Quote from: Brentai on November 16, 2008, 09:23:42 AM

when you start echoing a specific tenet of guildenstern you really need to take a good long look in the mirror and try to pinpoint the exact moment you became really fat

I think Zara's saying that a comic (or any art) is more than the sum of its parts; the existential exercises art puts the mind through are occasionally part of the design. Whether or not it's true in this particular comic's case, I can't say.

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Author Topic: Webcomics that aren't MSPA (Read 122858 times)