Topic: Make Up New Unlockables! (Read 59279 times)

Mongrel · « **Reply #360 on:** September 21, 2009, 07:55:00 PM »

WHAT.

HAHA I WAS ACTUALLY RIGHT ABOUT SOMETHING?!?!

WHAT.

Mongrel · « **Reply #361 on:** September 22, 2009, 07:18:20 AM »

Heh.

So it took me this long to actually find the link to the fake update: HANDY LINK.

So the short version is that this isn't a Valve joke, but they were so tickled by it that they linked to it on their blog. The achievements are precious.

McDohl · « **Reply #362 on:** September 22, 2009, 07:19:41 AM »

TA · « **Reply #363 on:** September 22, 2009, 11:45:51 AM »

That it will never be is a damnable, damnable shame.

SCD · « **Reply #364 on:** November 03, 2009, 01:37:13 PM »

The Gun locker - Engineer toolbox

Can construct 2 lvl1 sg's in addition to the normal lvl 3 sg, but no teleporters or dispensers.

McDohl · « **Reply #365 on:** November 03, 2009, 01:41:34 PM »

...you do realize what final stage PL maps will devolve in to from there, right?

Maybe sapping or damaging the big daddy will cause the baby sentries to combust, but still. That's nutty. I've seen teams on Badwater that set up three engineers to chain build a set of guns in the two dugout places underneath the map room and catwalk, and a third by the pillar near the lower spawn. Do you REALLY want NINE sentry guns on the final stage of Badwater for the price of three engies?

SCD · « **Reply #366 on:** November 03, 2009, 01:44:58 PM »

It's a hard question.

I've seen the RTD deal work decently, although in all fairness, most people who land "lay n sentries" don't know what to do with them.

I'm possibly thinking that there should be other drawbacks - the firepower of the other two should be only effective if concentrated, and only in a certain range.

I know that this is a can of worms, but it can be a good can of worms..

Let me think on this one..

Doom · « **Reply #367 on:** November 03, 2009, 01:48:54 PM »

The damage would have to be completely ineffectual to not be lethal. Surprise Sentries are based entirely on the premise of getting a level one or better behind "safe" lines of travel and then wrenching the guy in the head when he turns on it and thinks he'll "just barely" make it.

Bongo Bill · « **Reply #368 on:** November 03, 2009, 03:03:26 PM »

A single extra level 1 sentry wouldn't be too bad. Those things die quickly when unattended, and if an Engineer chooses to attend to their baby sentry instead of the mommy, then they deserve what the enemy Spy is about to do to it. Being sapped at the same time also makes a sort of sense.

McDohl · « **Reply #369 on:** November 03, 2009, 03:10:55 PM »

IF THE BABY SENTRY IS ATTACKED, THEN THE MOMMY SENTRY TURNS IN TO A BEAR AND MAULS THE GUY WHO ATTACKED IT

Bongo Bill · « **Reply #370 on:** November 03, 2009, 03:27:24 PM »

Point is, an ordinary Engineer doesn't really know what his sentry is capable of, especially a level-1 one, so of course he's going to think (mistakenly) that it's possible for it to be balanced to have more than one as-is.

However, with enough limits on the effectiveness of the extra when used for Doom-esque harassment - say, it takes a long time to build, it has next to no health, you can't repair it, you have to return to a resupply cabinet before building another one if it breaks, its range is shorter, it takes the full 200 metal, that sort of thing - it might still be possible to come up with something that makes it a fair trade. There are a lot of ways to make a sentry shitty.

'Course, I still like my force field idea best.

McDohl · « **Reply #371 on:** November 03, 2009, 03:49:56 PM »

The forcefield idea is pretty good, but it kinda sucks because of the area denial that the sentry represents. IF YOU WALK IN TO THIS AREA, CHANCES ARE THAT YOU WILL DIE. Granted, there are exceptions to this rule (I've managed to circle-strafe sentries and burn them to death inexplicably. Maybe because the sentry was watching the ubered heavy and not me, but I've seen it try to track me as I'm doing it.)

With the force-field, if I'm picturing it correctly, is basically saying "throw a demoman or a heavy at it, and the bubble bursts." They can even stand next to the damn thing while they're hammering at it.

Bongo Bill · « **Reply #372 on:** November 03, 2009, 04:02:53 PM »

Well, it might be more durable than a sentry and probably have a wider range at max, but the main idea is that enemies can't shoot past the bubble. Despite being an impassable force field, it's less for area denial and more for portable (sort of) cover. Throw one up, and your team hides behind it, safe from all non-Spy-related harm. A perfect complement to the so-called level 4 sentry, possibly too strong in conjunction with an actual sentry.

Similar concept: two pylon sort of things, placed within a certain distance of each other. Any enemy who stands in between them gets electrocuted. Instead of knockback, it pulls you into it, but you can escape by walking out or try to force yourself through. The closer together, the more damage they do. Not as loud as a sentry, except of course when they're firing. Breaking one doesn't break the other, but repairing/upgrading one does repair/upgrade the other, maybe. Upshot: harder to set up, harder to defend, covers less area, but better suited to certain situations.

Brentai · « **Reply #373 on:** November 03, 2009, 04:13:49 PM »

I think the "no dispensers" offset actually balances it nicely. You can't tank for very long with just spawn drops, so the enemy team should be plenty able to blow up the engie's big daddy and then pick off his awkwardly placed ambushes while he's scrambling around for metal. If anything it may be a debuff. Dispensers are fucking important.

Nine sentries on pl_goldrush with only two metal spawns to feed them does not sound like the winner it appears to be in concept.

McDohl · « **Reply #374 on:** November 03, 2009, 04:18:07 PM »

Well, the final points of each of goldrush's stages makes it easy for an engie to pop back in to the spawn, hit the locker, and run back out, dumping another baby sentry. Not as easy as a dispenser, true. Of course, you could have a FOURTH engie with a traditional, vanilla loadout for the dispenser, but again, that goes to the metal starvation problem.

Bongo Bill · « **Reply #375 on:** November 03, 2009, 04:19:52 PM »

One assumes they'll be picking up the weapons of the enemies killed by all the extra ordnance.

Mongrel · « **Reply #376 on:** November 03, 2009, 05:50:26 PM »

Quote from: Bongo Bill on November 03, 2009, 04:19:52 PM

One assumes they'll be picking up the weapons of the enemies killed by all the extra ordnance.

I may not be that great with surprise lvl 1 sentries, but I sure as hell know that braving bullets to grab that metal is golden (well, unless you're parked next to the locker or something).

Bongo Bill · « **Reply #377 on:** November 24, 2009, 09:25:32 PM »

Rocket launcher replacement: each rocket splits into four smaller rockets that are each about 1/3 the strength of a regular rocket, and have a smaller blast radius to make up for the fact that the rockets themselves will spread over a larger area. If the launcher is fully loaded, you can fire all of the rockets at once and they will all split at the same time, effectively carpet-bombing a very wide area with sixteen mini-rockets. Reloading and firing are both slower, and the knockback is reduced considerably, even with regard to rocket-jumps.

Sentry replacement: security field. A flat plane rather than a bubble. Stops all enemy fire that passes through it; enemies can walk right through, but they lose all their ammunition (including metal and maybe even watch charge) in the process (an ubercharge probably prevents this). Enemies who walk through one without being disguised spies are effectively banished to the melee zone). Optional: if a dispenser is placed within a certain range of the security field generator, a portion of the confiscated ammunition goes to refilling the dispenser.

Dispenser replacement: pocket dispenser! Instead of planting a dispenser to help your team have ammunition and health, you activate this little guy from the build panel and it refills a total of 200 metal at a rate slower than a level-1 dispenser will give you, then breaks down. You can get a new one by visiting a resupply closet, or deactivate it before it's depleted from the destroy panel (this does not restore its stock of metal). While it's active, your movement speed is reduced. It doesn't restore any health.

Sticky bomb replacement: proximity mine. Boring as hell. Detonates one or two seconds after an enemy is dumb enough to stick their dick within its range. Can't be manually detonated. Become duds but remain on the map after the death of the Demoman; a dud will act like it's going to explode right up to the point that it doesn't. Nobody can distinguish a dud from a working mine.

Zaratustra · « **Reply #378 on:** November 24, 2009, 10:28:02 PM »

Problem with that field is that it makes a sentry behind it pretty much invincible

Also instead of losing ammo I suggest it makes you go melee only for 5 or 10 seconds

Bongo Bill · « **Reply #379 on:** November 24, 2009, 10:30:57 PM »

If you've got two engineers covering each other, then I say their vantage deserves to be taken out only by tricky/coordinated spies or an ubercharge.

For a possible tweak, say it doesn't block critical shots, or, as a compromise measure, it lets them through but downgrades them to regular shots.

You could just go around it, anyway. Being a flat plane limits its usefulness somewhat, as virtually every map has alternate routes everywhere.

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Author Topic: Make Up New Unlockables! (Read 59279 times)