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[Ted Belmont]

You guys are all a bunch of

[Royal☭]

But then again, peeps can't even figure out that Freedom of Speech means sometimes, someone's gonna get butthurt over something someone said.

That's why I love freedom, because people stop making laws to protect people from their own feelings.

Freedom of speech doesn't mean you're protected from others calling you racist/an idiot.

And since nobody in this thread was requesting that the game be banned, this kind of argument has nothing to do with anything.

[Disposable Ninja]

3 Easy Steps to Determine if what you are doing is Bigoted and will Offend People:

1) Determine whether what you are making could potentially offend somebody.

2) Determine who you are going to offend.

3) Ask yourself "Why do I feel it is important to offend these people?"

In RE5's case:

1) Yes

2) Black People, Minorities, White People with White Guilt.

3) Fuck those uppity individuals, I'll do whatever I want and they can go suck it.

[sei]

3) Does it matter? If no, go to 7.
4) If yes, is there a way to preserve the artistic vision in such a way that they're not offended? If yes, go to 7.
5) Either revise the image, or include a character that's still great, despite being part of the stereotyped group.
6) Prepare every group has its good and its bad. Any further argument gets addressed in 7.
7)


If they pull D3's witchdoctor class, because a bunch of people think he's too close to putting a bone through his nose, I'm going to be pretty disappointed.

[Disposable Ninja]

Your whole post sort of made redundant by MY Step 3, "Why do I feel it is so important to offend these people?" Because if you can't come up with a good reason, you know, maybe you should fucking try to figure what the fuck it is you're actually trying to do.

Also: I hate the whole "Well, they're JAPANESE. They don't know any better!" argument. Resident Evil isn't some little independent joint concocted in the basement of some dude's basement meant only for a specific subculture in Shinjuku to understand. It's a massive, multi-million dollar, international IP that's spawned feature films in both in Japan and the U.S. If they want to fucking appeal to Americans, they should know God damn well what we like and don't like, and we told them two whole fucking E3's before the game was released that this shit wasn't kosher.

[jsnlxndrlv]

By the logic in this thread, Wolfenstein is bad because (a) some Germans were Nazis and (b) Germans were (negatively) stereotyped as Nazis.

(If "German" doesn't qualify as a race, due to all crackers look same, s/racist/negatively discriminatory/.)

I'd totally agree with you if anti-German sentiment had been a long-running problem in America causing German-Americans to experience discrimination as "potential Nazis" and subject to constant scrutiny for Nazi sympathies on an everday basis.

I mean, I'm right there with you on thinking the witch doctor looks totally badass—but having never really felt oppressed by the culture I live within, how can I presume to claim somebody who does object is wrong?

I'm pretty sure old white dude that oppresses people is a stereotype.

It's true that whites believe they are the victims of racism more often than blacks in America. And yet I really doubt whether any of these victims can disagree with the point being made 17 seconds into this video:

Louis CK - Being White

Are you suggesting that's not the case? I get the feeling that you're specifically objecting to the things I've been posting. I've said some pretty offensive things in my time which I've grown to regret, and seeing people and media perpetuating the same kind of attitudes causes me discomfort. Why should I be denied the opportunity to voice that discomfort?

[sei]

I'm not saying it's "wrong" to be offended.

I'm saying it's obnoxious to ruin other people's fun over it.

I'm sure there's a Mississippi game out there where people infused with the power of Christ can run heathen atheists over with Nascar cars, slam AMERICAN beer cans through their heads, or shoot them with guns shaped like crosses that fire radiant blue, exploding communion wafers, but I'm not going to waste time being a twat and demanding it get pulled.

That'd be uppity.

[Ted Belmont]

Also: I hate the whole "Well, they're JAPANESE. They don't know any better!" argument. Resident Evil isn't some little independent joint concocted in the basement of some dude's basement meant only for a specific subculture in Shinjuku to understand. It's a massive, multi-million dollar, international IP that's spawned feature films in both in Japan and the U.S. If they want to fucking appeal to Americans, they should know God damn well what we like and don't like, and we told them two whole fucking E3's before the game was released that this shit wasn't kosher.

To be fair, I'm sure there are large swaths of America where a game about killing hordes of subhuman, dark-skinned creatures was very well received.

I'm not saying it's "wrong" to be offended.

I'm saying it's obnoxious to ruin other people's fun over it.

I'm sure there's a Mississippi game out there where people infused with the power of Christ can run heathen atheists over with Nascar cars, slam AMERICAN beer cans through their heads, or shoot them with guns shaped like crosses that fire radiant blue, exploding communion wafers, but I'm not going to waste time being a twat and demanding it get pulled.

That'd be uppity.

So exactly when did anyone in this thread make any sort of demand that RE5 get pulled?

[Classic]

Also: I hate the whole "Well, they're JAPANESE. They don't know any better!" argument

Because it is also racist? No? That's not the reason?

Anyway, I've never played the game. But the premise just doesn't seem to be the kind of thing that Capcom could possibly tastefully pull off.

i.e., Setting a Resident Evil (or Biohazard) game in a continent where there is already a terrifying incurable virus infecting a huge swath of the population.

[Disposable Ninja]

Because it is also racist? No? That's not the reason?

Yeah, that too.

[TA]

Also: I hate the whole "Well, they're JAPANESE. They don't know any better!" argument. Resident Evil isn't some little independent joint concocted in the basement of some dude's basement meant only for a specific subculture in Shinjuku to understand. It's a massive, multi-million dollar, international IP that's spawned feature films in both in Japan and the U.S. If they want to fucking appeal to Americans, they should know God damn well what we like and don't like, and we told them two whole fucking E3's before the game was released that this shit wasn't kosher.

The "They're Japanese" thing isn't a way to excuse Capcom's behavior.  It's a recognition of the fact that Japanese culture is all kinds of fucked up as regards race and racism and that they don't understand that there's a problem with putting Golliwoggs in your game.  They do not have the history and cultural familiarity with the issue that (most of us here) do.

[Aintaer]

As a minority, I can say that some things you don't even think is racist is actually racist to us. But so what? It is understood that most people are racist in one way or another.

I know for a fact that every Asian is at the very least a secret racist. In fact, most colloquial terms for white people are in some ways derogatory in Chinese. Because to the Chinese, White people are subhuman, as are everybody who is not in the regional racism competition (i.e. Japan, Korea, China); There you have extra special racism.

Are Japanese any more racist than Chinese? Probably not, but they are exporting culture, and that's what you see. What is usually reserved for the privacy of the home is being woven into the public expression. And once that is exported into a new context, the original racism which is amusing in their culture is extra offensive.

White people are, in my experience, the only ones who are bothered by the fact that they are racist. And in being so, they have more passive-aggressive racism which in my opinion is worse.

[Classic]

If you could record and submit a dissertation on this "passive-aggressive racism" to an anthropology journal I would be serious pleased.

[sei]

I'm not saying it's "wrong" to be offended.

I'm saying it's obnoxious to ruin other people's fun over it.

I'm sure there's a Mississippi game out there where people infused with the power of Christ can run heathen atheists over with Nascar cars, slam AMERICAN beer cans through their heads, or shoot them with guns shaped like crosses that fire radiant blue, exploding communion wafers, but I'm not going to waste time being a twat and demanding it get pulled.

That'd be uppity.

So exactly when did anyone in this thread make any sort of demand that RE5 get pulled?

I wasn't suggesting they did. Also worth noting that the post complaining about Loco Roco was suggesting a palette swap, not pulling the game. Oil Man's recolor probably didn't kill MMPU for anyone.

Is this thread even about anything?

Is anyone suggesting that game designers may not use villains belonging to formerly persecuted ethnic groups? Or references to such groups' histories?

[Thad]

That's the same kind of argument you get from people complaining that American movies from the fifties are sexist (read: a bad one).

...seriously?

You're going to have to explain that one a bit more.  Because common American 1950's gender roles WERE straight up sexist.

Now, if you're talking about documentaries ABOUT the 1950's, or fictional accounts that strive for historical accuracy, yeah, okay, I'll grant there's a point there (for the same reason that anyone who thinks Huckleberry Finn is a racist book is a dumbshit).

But there ARE plenty of films from the 1950's that ARE straight-up sexist.  Movies that don't merely acknowledge the prevailing attitudes toward women but embrace them.

Also the fact that the white main character is A COP. White cops?!? Fuck man, not every white person is a cop that goes around beating up black people! So goddamn racist Capcom. As a white man I am offended!

...you know, if you'd had the good goddamn sense to say "Irish" you would have come close to roughly approximating a point.

Also fuck your racism arguments. You can't even figure out a goddamn moralistic standpoint that makes sense besides, "IT'S WROOOOONNNNGGGGG!!!!!", with a hefty helping of. "do I need to tell you? DO I EVEN!?!?!" [OH CHRIST, I AM SCARED]

But then again, peeps can't even figure out that Freedom of Speech means sometimes, someone's gonna get butthurt over something someone said.

That's why I love freedom, because people stop making laws to protect people from their own feelings.

I can't tell if you're using the stupidest, most incoherent assortment of random comments-section gibberish you can possibly come up with as a joke, or if you're actually that stupid.  I will give you the benefit of the doubt and let you off with a warning.

Next time make something that even remotely resembles a rational argument or I will boot you off this board.

As a minority, I can say that some things you don't even think is racist is actually racist to us. But so what? It is understood that most people are racist in one way or another.

Everyones A Little Bit Racist

[Bal]

I still think the game should have been set in South Africa, and all the bosses should have been white.

EDIT: Oh, and for the record, I don't buy into white guilt for myself personally. All of my ancestors came here after slavery, most of them having been busy being oppressed in Ireland or elsewhere, otherwise they'd never have moved, and I've never committed an intentional or overtly racist act in my life.

[Classic]

OH! So black folks can't be bosses now!? THE NERVE!!!

EDIT:
No, I have no fucking clue how serious either of us are being here. I DO suspect that they are entirely independent.

[Bal]

The joke is just that there are more black people in South Africa than whites, but the whites, even after apartheid, still hold most of the power. So if you're going to make a game set in Africa with fairly significant racial discomfort, if nothing else, then you might as well go whole hog and then pretend you were making a point.

[Norondor]

but that was already the case. The bosses are Meowth, a slut, and Wesker, the whitest white guy ever, even when he's a demi-helicopter

[Bal]

I'm going to be totally honest, I've never played RE5. Not because it's racist, but because it's garbage.