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[Royal☭]

EDIT: Oh, and for the record, I don't buy into white guilt for myself personally. All of my ancestors came here after slavery, most of them having been busy being oppressed in Ireland or elsewhere, otherwise they'd never have moved, and I've never committed an intentional or overtly racist act in my life.

Nothing against you personally, just whenever someone says something like this I always like posting this comic:

[Aintaer]

Also fuck your racism arguments. You can't even figure out a goddamn moralistic standpoint that makes sense besides, "IT'S WROOOOONNNNGGGGG!!!!!", with a hefty helping of. "do I need to tell you? DO I EVEN!?!?!" [OH CHRIST, I AM SCARED]

But then again, peeps can't even figure out that Freedom of Speech means sometimes, someone's gonna get butthurt over something someone said.

That's why I love freedom, because people stop making laws to protect people from their own feelings.

I can't tell if you're using the stupidest, most incoherent assortment of random comments-section gibberish you can possibly come up with as a joke, or if you're actually that stupid.  I will give you the benefit of the doubt and let you off with a warning.

I feel this is GoG's way of saying "I do not want this guilt after all I was not the racist one". The standpoint of the majority is that assuming traits just because a human is of a certain descent is diminishing of that human's individuality. It is wrong not because it happens, but because it blankets differences onto groups of people, contrary to the egalitarian ideals, and then pivots opinions of a person based on these presumptive traits.

Freedom does give you the right to be racist, but does not give you the right to take away my freedom. It is the fear of the latter that makes it difficult for the former, given this country's history.

If you could record and submit a dissertation on this "passive-aggressive racism" to an anthropology journal I would be serious pleased.

While I don't have the Sociological creds to publish a serious paper, I can point to certain examples of passive aggressive racism. Remember the UCLA rant girl? She tries to disguise her racism as lessons of courtesy and common sense, in that "You know I'd really appreciate it if you'd stop..." kind of way. Is it offensive? Definitely. Should it have been public? Probably not, if only for her own sake. But if it hadn't been, we wouldn't have had:

Vlog #4: Asians in the Library - UCLA Girl (Alexandra Wallace) going wild on Asians

Everyones A Little Bit Racist

What I was humming the whole time.

[Bal]

Almost none of that applies to me, Constantine, but even if it did I wouldn't feel guilty. I spend more than enough time feeling guilty for shit I actually did without worrying about things my ancestors may or may not have done or benefited from indirectly.

Now, I know for a fact that my Irish immigrant ancestors found being denied jobs and opportunities much preferable to outright starving to death, but they didn't benefit much from racism against blacks until later when they established themselves very deeply in public service (the only jobs they could get) and became preferable to the population at large, because at least they were white, even if they were all secret agents for the Pope.

As for me personally, I grew up in southern Arizona, where half my classmates were from somewhere south of the border, and so were half my teachers, and given the amount of time I spent in detention or suspended and almost expelled, I don't seem to recall any preferential treatment. Though in fairness I wasn't actually AT school that much, so maybe I just missed the chance.

Finally, I never said I never benefited from racism. Of course I do, I'm a white male. I just don't "suffer" from "white guilt" because it's a bullshit form of self-pity that makes white people feel a little bit better because at least they feel a little bit bad. What nonsense.

[Ziiro]

Wait a minute...

[Büge]

Late to the party, but... what racism means vs. what people think it means.

[Rico]

It's always nice to be reminded that racism only happens to non-whites.

[Classic]

A minnow and a tuna are both fish, right?

Yeah, but there are "subtle" differences that you're whitewashing to make that point.

It's always nice to be reminded that racism only happens to non-privileged people.

And though I'm sure we both understand what the poster actually said, I don't want to contribute to an obnoxious troll-y echo chamber in any forum but youTube.


EDIT:

I don't think anyone misinterpreted it, but everything above the Rico quote is Classic talking to himself. i.e. You is me.

[Brentai]

Racism is one of those words I wish the left would just fucking drop because it makes it SO FUCKING EASY for the opposition to construct semantic strawman arguments based on a generous interpretation of its most technical definition.

The last time I tried to have this argument it never got past "No no I THINK IT MEANS THIS so I don't see where this could ever be a problem" though, which is pretty much when I decided to become a hardcore moderate.

[Royal☭]

It's always nice to be reminded that racism only happens to non-whites.

Yeah, I remember that time in the 60s when whites weren't allowed into certain restaurants or were forced to use separate water fountains.

It is often the feeling of the privileged and the oppressing majority that they, too, are being oppressed simply because the minority resents them for the way they are treated.

[Beat Bandit]

Yeah, I remember that time in the 60s when whites weren't allowed into certain restaurants or were forced to use separate water fountains.

Our water fountains were just as separate but equal as theirs.

[Rico]

sorry, bring up white privelege all you want, I still think it's stupid to make a self-righteous blog post about updating the flawed dictionary definition of racism and then come up with something which is even worse. Real racism (not middle school slurs) and racial discrimination occur between any number of groups in the united states, let alone internationally.

And international racism problems, if you'll recall, are what started the thread.

[Aintaer]

Racism itself is just an uninformed perception of traits in people based only on the preconceptions of their physical appearance. The emotions and actions that racism inspired historically in the US made it about White/Non-white.

The most racist comments I've received were from black guys I didn't even know (I used to live in Crown Heights South, Brooklyn, population of about 100% Jamaicans and Trinidadians). With the Japanese, a mixture of cultural xenophobia and novelty (they'd put all the gaijin in zoos if they could) espoused their racism. With the Black Americans, history has fooled some of them into believe that they can't possibly be racist because of their past. Either way, it is racism. But as morally responsible people, I think the proper thing to do is simply to accept that people will be racist and try not to openly express racism yourself.

[Classic]

It's all OK though. I've discovered that I'm not actually racist anymore. I'm just classist and an prejudiced against people poorer than me (especially if they're not white).

[Büge]

EDIT: Oh, and for the record, I don't buy into white guilt for myself personally. All of my ancestors came here after slavery, most of them having been busy being oppressed in Ireland or elsewhere, otherwise they'd never have moved, and I've never committed an intentional or overtly racist act in my life.

Nothing against you personally, just whenever someone says something like this I always like posting this comic:

Really? Cause I think of this one:

[Bal]

That might be one of the most racist comics I've ever read.

Keep masturbating your own egos though, it's fine by me. Look how tolerant and guilty I am *fap fap fap*

EDIT: Can we have a sexism thread so you can all don your white knight armor? Not... not that kind of white knight.

[Lottel]

I'm not even sure what anyone is arguing anymore.





EDIT: This can probably be said for most threads on this forum.

[Brentai]

Those comics make me so mad I can't even form a valid criticism without just ranting in all caps.  I HATE, HATE, HATE, HATE, HATE, HATE IT when some chucklefuck starts campaigning a view I would normally agree with in a way so overblown and combative that any moderate would have to say, "You know what?  Fuck you, and fuck your cause."

I mean look, I get that white affluence was established on a base of institutionalized minority oppression.  I may have used too many liberal buzzwords there but it's something we all knew intuitively.  Even though I'm fairly certain my direct ancestors had typical Irish problems up until WW2, I'm sure those fat Kodak checks that both my grandfathers pulled in wouldn't have been possible without... whatever the hell Kodak ever did to minorities.

This example is being derailed quickly.

ANYWAY what pisses me off is the implication that if you're the indirect beneficiary of someone who enjoyed a basic American right that somebody else was denied, by somebody else, and through no fault directly OR indirectly of your benefactor's own, you are directly responsible for that person's beneficiaries.

I mean all that guy had to do was show even one example of a minority getting screwed over BECAUSE of the majority.  Just one instance of "Oh, we gave the last loan to THAT GUY, nyuk nyuk."

But, nope, it's clearly and specifically portrayed as separate and unrelated occurrences with no interrelation at all.  But it's still your fault, cracker.

Valid white guilt isn't enough.  You're not a true liberal until you've developed a full-on martyr complex.

As for the other one, I really only take issue with the #6 panel, because it's a viewpoint you two keep trying to push in this thread and all I've got to say about it is that I spent enough time in the shittier portions of LA to feel justified in saying that anyone who believes that it's impossible for shitty things to happen to a person just because they're caucasian can kiss my god damn ass.

[Bal]

I just find the entire stance to be the worst kind of self-indulgence. Oh great, he's feels bad for all the terrible things this country has done to minorities over the years, give this man a round of applause so he doesn't actually have to do anything about it. Congratulations, your consciences are clear by virtue of your wonderful guilt. Close call.

The only thing worse is the people who go so far as to make comics like that one, because yeah, that's the road to progress guys. Trap everyone in a guilt cycle, that'll get the social progress ball rolling. Rather than, you know, activism, or something like that.

Finally, making such a point of race and racism, makes racism the fucking point. How about instead of approaching a black guy with a sack full of white guilt, you just approach him like a human being, and move on from there. I'm pretty sure that's what MLK meant by "The content of a Man's character".

[Mongrel]

Hey guys, remember this thread?

[Classic]

No. I did not good sir!

Congratulations, your consciences are clear by virtue of your wonderful guilt.

I'm sorry, what?
Isn't the punchline of the 10 white lies comic that guilt is not an adequate replacement for trying to work past a race-based privilege discrepancy?

Those comics make me so mad

I grant that they're super-preachy and the first comic is tough to swallow because it ignores how these prejudices are or were demonstrably carried on into the 80's.

If a person isn't willing to acknowledge how they might be racist without meaning to be, there's no way to say, "Oh! That isn't very nice! I'll do my best not to do that."

Don't get me wrong, this is a case-by-case thing and there comes a point where the effort to conceal racism does more harm (in net) than good. But drawing attention to myths about disenfranchisement and racism, especially the myths held by the privileged is worthwhile.

EDIT:
So, I've looked over that first comic again and it's annoying me more and more, but I'm not angry enough to do any kefkas.

EDIT EDIT:

How about instead of approaching a black guy with a sack full of white guilt, you just approach him like a human being, and move on from there. I'm pretty sure that's what MLK meant by "The content of a Man's character".

BECAUSE APPARENTLY "ON AVERAGE" WE'RE VERY FUCKING BAD AT DOING JUST THAT EVEN WITH THE BEST OF INTENTIONS.