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Author Topic: I'm a Star Wars  (Read 40869 times)

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Brentai

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #300 on: October 30, 2012, 12:42:26 PM »

That wasn't Niku being funny, by the way.  Disney actually announced Episode 7.

http://thewaltdisneycompany.com/disney-news/press-releases/2012/10/disney-acquire-lucasfilm-ltd

Plinkett has already begun the scream of torment that will tear the Earth apart.  Sandy was made by his initial gasp of shock.  On December 21, he will bang his fists in grief, and humanity will die.
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Büge

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #301 on: October 30, 2012, 12:48:23 PM »

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TA

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #302 on: October 30, 2012, 01:07:47 PM »

Oh wait, there's now a non-zero chance that Joss Whedon could direct.

This.

Just about all of 1-3's problems can be traced back to "Written and Directed by George Lucas", and he's doing neither.  He gets to be a "creative consultant" and that's it, which is as close to not involved as you can get.  Mouse gives no fuck.
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Büge

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #303 on: October 30, 2012, 01:57:26 PM »

Quote
In 2015, we're planning to release Star Wars Episode 7 – the first feature film under the "Disney-Lucasfilm" brand. That will be followed by Episodes 8 and 9 – and our long term plan is to release a new Star Wars feature film every two to three years.

They didn't say for how long. That means they could keep releasing new movies...

Forever
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Thad

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #304 on: October 30, 2012, 01:58:23 PM »

There's a part of me that sees a tragedy in history's greatest creator-owned success story being bought out by Disney, no matter how crummy the last 3 or 4 movies were.

But yeah it'd be hard (not impossible) for 7-9 to be as bad as 1-3, and Disney's got its pick of talented directors.  Unfortunately I think we can probably cross Andrew Stanton off the likely list because herp derp John Carter, never mind that John Carter would have been a financial success if it had been a Star Wars movie.  But hey, there's still Brad Bird.

Busiek brings up the question of comics, and I think it's likely we're going to see what happened with Boom and the Disney licenses -- which is fucking tragic.  I've never been a big reader of Dark Horse's Star Wars comics but I'm looking forward to Brian Wood's series, and Busiek's right that Marvel's unlikely to give the franchise as much TLC as Dark Horse has.

More broadly, for all his excesses in the prequel trilogy and the constant surgery on the original trilogy, Lucas has been very permissive both on official and unofficial universe-building.  To my knowledge he's never cracked down on fan edits or other forms of infringement, and has openly encouraged parody works like Troops.  I find it hard to believe that Disney will be so friendly toward the fandom.

I think it's very likely that the end result here will be "better movies, worse everything else".  And it's hard to say that's a good thing.
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Mongrel

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #305 on: October 30, 2012, 03:12:09 PM »

I think the Marvel angle is likely correct, since the original Star wars comics were actually published by Marvel.

What'll be really interesting is what they do with the continuity. See, Trek never has this problem because all their supplemental material (books, comics, etc.) are all 100% non-canon. So nobody really ever had to give two fucks.

But SW always tried to have everything be canon so as to increase world-building and mass appeal (of course that left them with vast swaths of awful drek that amounted to "officially-sanctioned fanfiction").

With the prequels it kind of worked, roughly speaking because they'd been anticipated for so long that from the early 90's onward there was more or less a ban on any books or comics from what would become the prequel era, so only a few old bits exist that even hint at that period. But there's possibly a literal boatload of fiction drawn up to replace the we-thought-they-would-probably-never-be-released Episodes 7/8/9.

Lucas has previously said (on multiple occasions) that he thinks the Dark Empire books are the closest thing he thinks of to a sequel, whereas a straw poll of SW fans usually has them saying the Thrawn Trilogy feels like the spiritual 7/8/9. Of course the Dark Empire books are almost comedic in how bad they are whereas the Thrawn books are one of the few Star Wars books that actually stand as pretty good books in their own right. Going with either of those as the basis for episodes 7/8/9 will be a telling choice. As would drop-kicking both and exploding the continuity (and most fan-boys heads). God know this cartoon they put out doesn't even seem to bother with internal consistency, let alone proper consistency with the movies.

Even if they pick-and-choose elements without using whole stories, there's the question of which elements they choose. Imagine the nerdrage if they dropped Mara Jade!

For the record: I'm not in love with SW (and I'm not sure I ever was), but I have a pretty detailed knowledge of the overarching backstory because I used to hang with a whole gaggle of diehards, so this stupid shit interests me the way the Cubs do a non-fan who nevertheless lives in Chicago. It'll be interesting to see what they do!
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Bongo Bill

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #306 on: October 30, 2012, 03:32:57 PM »

Using the better elements of the EU as inspiration could produce good outcomes, but I'm hoping they just disregard it completely. I'm prepared to go full exuberance on this, and if they've got the talent to live up to it, I'd like to experience being around for a "Vader is Luke's father"-caliber revelation in cinema during my lifetime. All the major sci-fi and fantasy movie series during my lifetime were either adaptations or became bad in the first sequel.

Books, video games, television, and media that didn't exist when I was born have all produced original material with justified sequel hype, but no movie that surprised me ever has, unless you count The Phantom Menace's quality as a surprise. To build an attachment to a world, then bring me back into it, in such a way that I don't know what's going to happen but still care enough to try to predict - if they can do that, then they'll have given me all I ever wanted.
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Mongrel

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #307 on: October 30, 2012, 03:48:18 PM »

One consideration is the age of the real actors. They may do something with the generation after Luke/Han/Leia & co and just have the originals make cameos as force ghosts/grandads.

The books done of that eras are especially awful, even by SW standards, so I think they could get away with just trashing the continuity completely and maybe having something roughly like the Thrawn Trilogy vaguely alluded to as backstory falling between episode 6 and 7.

Come to think about it, that really would be the smartest way to go about it.
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Bongo Bill

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #308 on: October 30, 2012, 04:08:26 PM »

Think of it: Mark Hamill reprises his role, only this time, he's the wise inscrutable mentor who dies to make the hero sad.
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jsnlxndrlv

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #309 on: October 30, 2012, 04:13:25 PM »

And in perfect circularity, Luke's son or whoever is played by Hayden Christensen!
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Mongrel

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #310 on: October 30, 2012, 04:16:15 PM »

And in perfect circularity, Luke's son or whoever is played by Hayden Christensen!

Vader Noooo
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Thad

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #311 on: October 30, 2012, 04:37:25 PM »

(...oh.  I thought I posted this like 90 minutes ago but I got WARNING NEW REPLY.  Well, posting as-is even if bits turn out to be redundant.)

So I was thinking of other directors who could pull it off -- Peter Jackson, Sam Raimi, Frank Oz, maybe Barry Sonnenfeld if he got his shit back together -- and it hit me: Guillermo del Toro.

I mean, feel free to keep throwing suggestions out, but I'm pretty sure I just won.

Anyway.  Thoughts from a casual fan (seen all the movies, some of the cartoons, read some of the comics, played some of the games, never read any of the books or the like) on what it should be like:

Well, you gotta get Ford, Fisher, and Hamill onboard.  Whatever it takes.  A cut of the merchandising if they ask for it; give them what they want.  They shouldn't be the main characters but they need to be in the thing.

And the thing is, that gives us a timeframe.  Unless you pull some goofy Tron/X-Men 3 shit and try to make them look unconvincingly younger, you are looking at a Star Wars movie that takes place 30 years after Return of the Jedi.  (Assuming normal, twenty-first-century human aging for our protagonists -- if you wanted you could throw in some mumbo-jumbo and make it still later.  But I think that'd be a mistake.)

So what's happened in thirty years?

Well, rebuilding the Republic is going to be a much trickier damn task than Palpatine's hostile takeover.  I'm thinking we're looking at a Wild West of warring fiefdoms.  The Sith are still out there -- in fact they're higher-profile now than they were in the first six movies -- and while you can't expect the Sith to be a unified front, I expect they control different warring factions of what used to be the Empire.

Leia -- well, here's a conundrum.  Presumably she'd have been the President of the New Republic when it formed, but thirty years later -- what?  Has she followed her mother's example, accepted a term limit, and become a Senator or some other lower-ranking official?  Or has she continued to hold the office of President/Chancellor/Whatever despite the rather uncomfortable fact that that would basically make her a new Empress?  Would she hang onto power "for the greater good" despite discomfort with the idea of resembling the very dictatorship she overthrew, or would she step down and find herself subservient to a potentially weak and corrupt series of successors?

Luke -- he's basically rebuilding the Jedi Order from the damn ground up, and he's faced with the dilemma of deciding just how close the new Order will be to the Old, which, as we've already noted at some length, was basically worthless and decadent.  (At the very least he should allow Jedi to marry, for God's sake.)  There are bound to be other Jedi still out there, older than he is and more inclined toward the Old Ways.

And I see friction between him and his sister -- her wanting the Order to take a more active role in governance, as it did in their mother's time, and him wanting to stay apolitical.  Presumably they'd be on the same page on taking out the Sith, but maybe not much else.

Han -- Han is Davos motherfucking Seaworth, except Stannis is his wife.  (Ooh -- Benioff and Weiss would be another good choice to direct.)

But all that should just be a backdrop.  The main characters should be original -- maybe Han and Leia's daughter I guess if that's the way you want to go, give a sense of continuity, but ideally mostly new characters with no ties to the old.

'Cept maybe the villain.  I'm thinking Ahsoka Tano.
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Mongrel

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #312 on: October 30, 2012, 04:55:17 PM »

Quote
At the very least he should allow Jedi to marry, for God's sake.

FWIW, the de-monk-ing of the Jedi is a pretty huge thing in the post RotJ EU.
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Brentai

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #313 on: October 30, 2012, 06:01:09 PM »

The director question was brought up before in "Who would be best to direct the re-prequels" (and I'd honestly wish they'd do that instead of 7+) and my answer came up Zack Snyder.  I think it still stands for sequels too - my main consideration was who could make something with the same visual oomph as Star Wars in the modern era of CG.  The fact that his career is mostly based on giving beloved franchises a respectable film outing, even in cases when they really shouldn't have been up there in the first place, helps immensely.

As far as writing around the idea of writing around the old characters... well, not to be rude, but I'd really hate to see elderly Hamill, elderly Ford and especially elderly Fisher prancing around in their old outfits.  I haven't seen Crystal Skull so I don't have that idea of what it might look like but... nope.

My biggest problem with speculating is that, really, the OT wrapped things up with a bow and the Prequels went and put a lock on it.  The bullshit prophecy is fulfilled, evil Jedis are dead forever, Jar-Jar eesa free.  I can't come up with a satisfying continuation that isn't "We need your help against the NEW, STRONGER enemy!" that doesn't feel like some sort of animu asspull.  At the very least, it undermines the idea that all the Star Wars up to the Tossing of the Emperor have been this one, multigenerational, epic struggle between Dark and Not-Dark.
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Smiler

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #314 on: October 30, 2012, 06:20:13 PM »

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TA

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #315 on: October 30, 2012, 07:21:27 PM »

The director question was brought up before in "Who would be best to direct the re-prequels" (and I'd honestly wish they'd do that instead of 7+) and my answer came up Zack Snyder.  I think it still stands for sequels too - my main consideration was who could make something with the same visual oomph as Star Wars in the modern era of CG.  The fact that his career is mostly based on giving beloved franchises a respectable film outing, even in cases when they really shouldn't have been up there in the first place, helps immensely.

As far as writing around the idea of writing around the old characters... well, not to be rude, but I'd really hate to see elderly Hamill, elderly Ford and especially elderly Fisher prancing around in their old outfits.  I haven't seen Crystal Skull so I don't have that idea of what it might look like but... nope.

My biggest problem with speculating is that, really, the OT wrapped things up with a bow and the Prequels went and put a lock on it.  The bullshit prophecy is fulfilled, evil Jedis are dead forever, Jar-Jar eesa free.  I can't come up with a satisfying continuation that isn't "We need your help against the NEW, STRONGER enemy!" that doesn't feel like some sort of animu asspull.  At the very least, it undermines the idea that all the Star Wars up to the Tossing of the Emperor have been this one, multigenerational, epic struggle between Dark and Not-Dark.

Zack Synder is the best director I know of for turning comic books into movies, but his record with original stories - even original stories within an established canon - is ... spotty.

Both Guillermo del Toro and Joss Whedon are in long-term relationships with Disney, and have a good track record with sci fi nerddom.  Whedon's a safer bet, but is probably too busy with Avengers 2.

del Toro would find a way to get Ron Perlman in the movie, though.  And that's all he really needs to do.
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Büge

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #316 on: October 30, 2012, 07:47:13 PM »

Just as long as he's not playing a wookiee. I want to hear him speak, after all, not just say "rowruurrurrow" and "GRAAAAAH!"
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Disposable Ninja

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #317 on: October 30, 2012, 08:02:36 PM »

Ron Perlman? In Star Wars?

I had... honestly never thought of that before.

I have an erection.
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Friday

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #318 on: October 30, 2012, 08:12:24 PM »

your post is somewhat wrong here let me fix it

Quote
Ron Perlman?

I have an erection.
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Büge

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Re: I'm a Star Wars
« Reply #319 on: October 30, 2012, 08:30:40 PM »

Quote from: http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Sequel_trilogy
During ShoWest 2008, Lucas gave an interview where he mentioned the difference between "his world", "the licensing world" and the "fans' world":

Interviewer: "Do you think you'd have other people continue the Star Wars saga past Episode VI or turn some of the other material into films?"
Lucas: "But there's no story past Episode VI, there's just no story. It's a certain story about Anakin Skywalker and once Anakin Skywalker dies, that's kind of the end of the story. There is no story about Luke Skywalker, I mean apart from the books."

Another noteworthy exchange between Lucas and an interviewer appeared in the May 2008 edition of Total Film magazine:

TOTAL FILM: "Are you happy for new Star Wars tales to be told after you're gone?"
LUCAS: "I've left pretty explicit instructions for there not to be any more features. There will definitely be no Episodes VII-IX. That's because there isn't any story. I mean, I never thought of anything. And now there have been novels about the events after Episode VI, which isn't at all what I would have done with it. The Star Wars story is really the tragedy of Darth Vader. That is the story. Once Vader dies, he doesn't come back to life, the Emperor doesn't get cloned and Luke doesn't get married..."

They say money changes people.
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