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Author Topic: Running-Mate Discussion  (Read 39397 times)

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Kazz

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #240 on: September 11, 2008, 07:22:49 PM »

I don't even know what's being expressed here.
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Thad

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #241 on: September 11, 2008, 07:33:00 PM »

I read it as simply contrasting Shinra's longer, more reasoned post with Brent's knee-jerk, violent one -- in which case, I hate to say it, but he has a point.

Of course, his next post doesn't seem to reinforce that.
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Shinra

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #242 on: September 11, 2008, 07:38:23 PM »

I read it as simply contrasting Shinra's longer, more reasoned post with Brent's knee-jerk, violent one -- in which case, I hate to say it, but he has a point.

Of course, his next post doesn't seem to reinforce that.

He edited my post in the quote.

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Brentai

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #243 on: September 11, 2008, 07:40:04 PM »

Except we're not exactly talking about her accidentally calling somebody a nigger here.

A person's allowed to make "human" mistakes; inhuman ones, not so much.
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Shinra

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #244 on: September 11, 2008, 07:44:47 PM »

Hey, you know what? You have your goddamn opinions. Leave me with mine.

The problem with your request is that you tend to butt them into discussions in the least constructive ways possible. Considering that you're on the opposite political spectrum from 95% of the board's population, and that you've displayed time and time again that you can't contribute meaningfully to a discussion, maybe you should stop presenting your opinions where they're not wanted if you want us to just leave you and your opinions alone.
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Brentai

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #245 on: September 11, 2008, 07:47:22 PM »

...who are you and what have you done with our community toolbox?
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Shinra

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #246 on: September 11, 2008, 07:49:01 PM »

Your mom. You need to clean up your room, young man, or one of these days you're going to come home and all of your things are going to be in the dumpster.
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Brentai

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #247 on: September 11, 2008, 07:51:11 PM »

...um.  I know you don't know this, but that just happened.
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Detonator

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #248 on: September 11, 2008, 07:51:32 PM »

Before this gets split to Jail: Guild, please be clear about what you are arguing.  Having people not understand you does not make you look better.  And if you don't want to have your views challenged, don't post them on the debate board.  

And everyone: try not to be sarcastic or condescending here.  This is supposed to be the one place where we leave that behind.  You know you're right, right?  Then you don't have to be a douche while arguing.

Just a friendly reminder.
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"Imagine punching somebody so hard that they turned into a door. Then you found out that's where ALL doors come from, and you got initiated into a murder club that makes doors. The stronger you punch, the better the door. So there are like super strong murderers who punch people into Venetian doors and shit"

Shinra

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #249 on: September 11, 2008, 07:52:33 PM »

...um.  I know you don't know this, but that just happened.

I tried to warn you.
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Kazz

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #250 on: September 11, 2008, 07:59:30 PM »

I hate all of your opinions, all of the time.  And I'm going to bug you about them.  But leave mine alone.
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Thad

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #251 on: September 11, 2008, 08:16:27 PM »

The problem with everyone trying to explain to Guild what he's doing wrong is that you're all just repeating what I've been saying nonstop since April.  He gets it.  He just doesn't care.  He knows exactly what he's not supposed to be doing, and he's doing it anyway.
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Royal☭

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #252 on: September 11, 2008, 08:17:56 PM »

Because he knows it will get under your skin, and Guild enjoys that.  He's not trying to convert us or make a point, he's trying to piss us off.

Also, Thad, that's plagiarism and it will sink your presidential campaign this year.

Guild

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #253 on: September 11, 2008, 08:22:32 PM »

Before this gets split to Jail: Guild, please be clear about what you are arguing.  Having people not understand you does not make you look better.  And if you don't want to have your views challenged, don't post them on the debate board.  

And everyone: try not to be sarcastic or condescending here.  This is supposed to be the one place where we leave that behind.  You know you're right, right?  Then you don't have to be a douche while arguing.

Just a friendly reminder.

Thanks, Det.

Constantine's post was trolling (what I usually do, but amn't allowed to anymore because i'm a dirty sinner. my reaction was considered a norm in thad's board, from my perspective), while my quote of Shinra was intended to be expository of Shinra's unfair, biased conjecture, in my opinion.

Did I follow all the rules? This seems like a silly way to talk about politics. I feel like I want to grab a sword and challenge someone to a duel.

If I posted similarly to Shinra using Obama in place of Biden and a few minor other alterations, you would all say I was being a closed-minded jackass.

"I'm waiting for Obama to say something incredibly stupid. Obama's camp was trying to avoid this by keeping him centered in the media until the media overlooks his shortcomings. They have got to keep him on a shiny, golden platform; An ultra-liberal, ultra left-wing spitter-in-the-faces of our culture who is confirmed as a secessionist is basically a walking gaffe factory. Plus he's black."

The point here is that being a member of a group, like christianity, doesn't automatically infer racism or a lack of political suave.
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Detonator

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #254 on: September 11, 2008, 08:36:29 PM »

Constantine's post was trolling (what I usually do, but amn't allowed to anymore because i'm a dirty sinner. my reaction was considered a norm in thad's board, from my perspective), while my quote of Shinra was intended to be expository of Shinra's unfair, biased conjecture, in my opinion.

Did I follow all the rules? This seems like a silly way to talk about politics. I feel like I want to grab a sword and challenge someone to a duel.

If I posted similarly to Shinra using Obama in place of Biden and a few minor other alterations, you would all say I was being a closed-minded jackass.

"I'm waiting for Obama to say something incredibly stupid. Obama's camp was trying to avoid this by keeping him centered in the media until the media overlooks his shortcomings. They have got to keep him on a shiny, golden platform; An ultra-liberal, ultra left-wing spitter-in-the-faces of our culture who is confirmed as a secessionist is basically a walking gaffe factory. Plus he's black."

The point here is that being a member of a group, like christianity, doesn't automatically infer racism or a lack of political suave.

You made a valid point without stooping to their level, and I admire that.  I admit that I'm more likely to let things slide when I agree with someone, so as the lone dissenter you need to help us root out our jackassery.  Just try not to get indignant about it and we'll do our best to correct the mistakes.  You'll have to be the bigger man here.  It's unfair, yeah, but you're the only voice of your side, so you have to make it count.
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"Imagine punching somebody so hard that they turned into a door. Then you found out that's where ALL doors come from, and you got initiated into a murder club that makes doors. The stronger you punch, the better the door. So there are like super strong murderers who punch people into Venetian doors and shit"

Guild

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #255 on: September 11, 2008, 09:01:53 PM »

Right gentlemanly of you, sir.
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Brentai

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #256 on: September 11, 2008, 09:15:18 PM »

So the topic of extreme importance has been derailed to discuss some supporter being a total clown.

I'm done here.  Tell me when this thread's been jailed.
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Thad

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #257 on: September 11, 2008, 09:18:51 PM »

my reaction was considered a norm in thad's board, from my perspective

Please do feel free to find me a single other example of someone taking a lengthy post and randomly changing words in it so that people have to go over it with a fucking magnifying glass to find out what the hell the point of the post is actually supposed to be.

You can hide behind the "high-context" label all you want, but any idiot can see you make your posts incomprehensible on purpose.

But rather than make this a conversation entirely about you, again, I'll play along for now and get back to the subject at hand.

If I posted similarly to Shinra using Obama in place of Biden and a few minor other alterations, you would all say I was being a closed-minded jackass.

There may be some validity in this claim.  Unfortunately, you then proceed to support it through the use of false equivalence.

"I'm waiting for Obama to say something incredibly stupid. Obama's camp was trying to avoid this by keeping him centered in the media until the media overlooks his shortcomings.

The media just spent two days saying he called a woman pig because he used a common figure of speech.

They have got to keep him on a shiny, golden platform; An ultra-liberal, ultra left-wing spitter-in-the-faces of our culture

Here you use "spitter-in-the-faces of our culture" as equivalent to "religio-facist [sic]".  Huh?

who is confirmed as a secessionist

How is Obama a confirmed secessionist at all?

I'll grant Shinra's exaggerating in calling Palin a "confirmed secessionist", but she IS married to one and DID speak to a convention of them.

Plus he's black."

I don't see that as equivalent to anything Shinra said at all.

The point here is that being a member of a group, like christianity, doesn't automatically infer racism or a lack of political suave.

...The constant use of "infer" for "imply" is another of those things I'm fairly confident you're doing on purpose just to annoy me.  Knock it off.  I know some guys would put up with that kind of thing, but frankly, I can't imagine why.

At any rate, this is a strawman.  Nobody's saying Palin is a racist or not politically talented just because she's a Christian.  Every single fucking person in this race and every President in the history of America is a Christian.

There's a difference between being simply being a Christian and subscribing to a radical, fringe system of beliefs -- and if you want to talk about double-standards, Palin's crazy pastor hasn't received NEARLY the media coverage that Obama's did.

Palin's record reveals her as someone with far-right social conservative views that should give a Libertarian-leaning Republican such as yourself pause -- she believes in abstinence-only sex education, teaching creationism in science class, banning books, banning abortion even for victims of rape and incest, belongs to a church that "cures" gays, and, as Noro noted in the post Shinra quoted Brent quoting, made rape victims pay for their own forensic tests.

Inferring racism or anti-semitism from extreme social conservatism may not be PC (see what I did there?), but these things often go hand-in-hand.  I certainly think her sneer every time she said "community organizer" in her speech was about more than a job title -- I would argue it's more about class than race, but those are also two things that often go hand-in-hand.

As for the part about the McCain campaign keeping Palin away from the press out of concern that she'd make a gaffe?  As TA noted at the top of page 12, that's not conjecture, that's pretty much exactly right.

I'm willing to acknowledge that Shinra indulged in some exaggerations and some conjecture.  But the way you've gone about criticizing him for it -- a hard-to-read post followed by clarification by way of false comparison -- doesn't help your case.
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Shinra

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #258 on: September 12, 2008, 04:46:32 AM »

I was more equating palin to other far right blowhards who have a tendency to be A: extremely, painfully conservative and B: say and do stupid things. Palin didn't have to deal with swing state voters; she just had to be farther right than the next guy in the reddest state in the country. She has not been groomed to never, ever say what she's actually thinking.

Everyone is at least a little racist. There isn't exactly a huge black community in alaska, and their media portrayal isn't exactly fantastic. If you're not willing to give that she's capable of thinking and saying something racist, Guild, I'd say you're fucking kidding yourself.
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Guild

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Re: Running-Mate Discussion
« Reply #259 on: September 12, 2008, 03:56:04 PM »

If you're not willing to give that she's capable of thinking and saying something racist, Guild, I'd say you're fucking kidding yourself.

Read that again, Shinra, and tell me why it's insipid.

Or you can cheat and read below:

There is a person you do not know. Do you A) Assume they are a serial killer/pedophile/racist/cultist/blood-drinker and go around shouting such, or do you B) Find out first if they are a serial killer/pedophile/racist/cultist/blood-drinker and THEN go around shouting such?
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