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[Ted Belmont]

For those of us who won't be able to see it this week. 

[Niku]

My one niggling complaint about the film is not taking the easy fanservice route at some points, and that is so beside the scope of the entire movie that I don't even really care.  (but seriously you have an unnamed female hispanic cop for the entire movie and only drop in the last half hour or so that she's not Renee Montoya?)

otherwise holy fuck

[Cannon]

My complaints are that it's really quite wordy (like most modern comics, natch), Bale at times can't keep up with Ledger, and the sudden lack of music where one instinctively wants a score will distract.

The exploration of morality, tragedy, and being an inspiration was something crucial, and for any flaws the flick has, I can forgive them all. I could see what Nolan meant about Joker being an "absolute," and at times Grant Morrison's notion of him re-inventing himself daily were in the back of my head. At this point, I just want to go on down the line about things that put a smile on my face-ah.

The Pencil. ...That was after the wince, of course.
Ledger and Nolan studied birthday clown magicians for inspiration, I see. Even with Batman's gadgets, both he and the audience had to stay on their toes.
Two-Face never once referred to himself as "we," because he's an impulsive vigilante, not an overblown Arkham headcase. Which means he was Two-Face.
"Do you want to know how I got my scars?"
The 'Sons of Batman.'
It took me a while to understand the significance of Joker favoring knives, and then the detonators he used for his social experiment.
Why no one would blackmail Bruce.

[Rosencrantz]

GODDAMN, that was a good movie! I am really, really anxious to see it again. Luckily, I got a bunch of movie passes for my birthday a couple of weeks ago.

It kinda bugs me that they killed off Dent - especially since I totally saw him breathing - but I like the intention and the result. Batman was already considered a criminal and a vigilante, but now it's even worse than that, and he shouldn't have the problem of people trying to imitate him anymore (but then, the Joker's video probably helped that, too).

I knew that that one cop wasn't Montoya because she was already named in Gotham Knight. Still sucks that it wasn't her. I read a theory somewhere (maybe on this very board, but I'm too tired to check) that similar to how the original DA was killed off in Begins to make way for Harvey, the cops in Dark Knight are killed off/arrested to make way for Montoya/Bullock/whoever else.

I think they should have had Joker do his fake origin story one more time before the last one where Batman interrupts him. There just seemed to be too long of a block of time between the second one and the ending. But that's just a tiny, silly complaint about an otherwise terrific movie.

[Cannon]

I was really thrown when Not Montoya was partnered with Crispus Allen for one of the Gotham Knight shorts. So sometimes this kind of stuff is all over the board.

...Though if Rene' had shown up, I'd probably be unreasonable and look for Question references, so... Hmm. I guess us nerds can just sabotage our own expectations sometimes.

[Arc]

Detective Ramirez was originally written as Renee Montoya, but Nolan changed the character's name once she evolved into being corrupt. This is both maddening, but admittedly respecting the character. Why they didn't just make Detective Stephens (the one who Joker had taunted and then taken hostage) into Detective Harvey Bullock is beyond me, but is still open to being rectified.

Two-Face's death is my one true problem with the film, but Eckhart did sign a two picture deal. Which could still mean nothing. If his normal eye was closed after the fall, I could accept the possibility, but to my recollection it was open.

Biggest shocker was in how Gordon came back into the picture. That little twist went under the radar even in spoiler discussions before release, and the midnight crowd ate it up.

[Detonator]

I wanted to spend the whole second half of the movie giving poor Dent some eyedrops.  I don't know how you burn off all of the skin and most of the flesh from half your face, but that eye only suffers minor redness.

[Mothra]

That really should not have bugged me nearly as much as it did. Dude's eye must've been on fire.

... ag... again...

[Cannon]

I'm willing to accept that at least part of Harvey's madness was due to pain, yeah.

Biggest shocker was in how Gordon came back into the picture. That little twist went under the radar even in spoiler discussions before release, and the midnight crowd ate it up.

I was kinda' in shock, too. I was riveted to most everything that was occurring on-screen, but for a good ten minutes, I honestly didn't think Nolan was bold enough to keep him dead. It was kind of arresting.

[Rosencrantz]

Two-Face's death is my one true problem with the film, but Eckhart did sign a two picture deal. Which could still mean nothing. If his normal eye was closed after the fall, I could accept the possibility, but to my recollection it was open.

I definitely remember his good eye being closed. That said, here is why I think he's probably not dead:

*Like I mentioned before, I (and other people I saw the movie with) totally saw him breathing. Could just be a mistake, I guess.
*His coin was good side up after his fall - "live" versus "die".
*No coffin at the funeral. This could just be because it was a memorial ceremony, but still.
*It may have been a callback to the earlier "falling" scene with Maroni. "Falling from this height won't kill me!" "I'm counting on it."
*The two-picture deal that Arc mentioned.
EDIT: I forgot one! *The movie already set up Gordon faking his death for a while as well.

[Disposable Ninja]

Harvey Dent died

Two-Face lives

Also, I was surprised that The Joker was actually getting laughs from the audience. That's a damn fucking accomplishment.

Also, the scene at the end with the Joker hanging upside down. That was a mother fucking scene.

[Brentai]

Yeah, pretty sure Two-Face is alive.  Whether or not we'll actually see him again is another matter, given supe-movies' habit of throwing out used villains for brand new ones.

My stepfather and I are placing bets on Penguin for the big bad of the next one.  He's the only obvious one who fits, though I'm personally rooting for Clayface.

Anyhow: overall I got the impression that this was the Empire Strikes Back of the new Batman series - that interim movie where the good guys get their asses kicked to shit and back and manage only a token victory at the very end - which implies that there may just be a beginning, middle, and end to this.  Probably not, but if so then that raises the question - how's it going to "end" in the next 2-3 hours?

Also, what's up with all the importance around Gordon's son, and Barbara Unnamed Gordon having nothing but a cameo?  Is there some significance that one of you comic book reading assholes can explain to me?

Let me know, damn you, or I'll show you my magic trick.

[Niku]

My stepfather and I are placing bets on Penguin for the big bad of the next one.  He's the only obvious one who fits, though I'm personally rooting for Clayface.

Batman is on the wrong side of the law.

I'm rooting for Charles Victor motherfucking Szasz.

[Rico]

Also, what's up with all the importance around Gordon's son, and Barbara Unnamed Gordon having nothing but a cameo?  Is there some significance that one of you comic book reading assholes can explain to me?

The end scene with the kids was set up to be very reminiscent of the end of Year One, where Bruce in motorcycle-wear dives off the side of a bridge to save Gordon's son.

The only major flaw in the movie that stuck with me right after leaving the theater last night (at 3 AM... ow) was--just like last time--Rachel Dawes.  Changing the actress doesn't matter if the part is still terrible, and it felt like a major, major cop-out to recycle the love interest.  Though Eckhart did a very, very good job portraying Dent I just didn't care that Rachel died and I think Harvey really deserved his own story and not Batman's cast-off lovers.

Like just about every other villain ever (though this  certainly rivals), the Animated Series did it way better, giving Harvey his own tragic fiancé and having you care not because Batman is so choked up over his poorly-written whore but because he's lost a good friend in a tragedy.

Cut Rachel out of the movie entirely, give Harvey a Grace, and spend more of the first segments showing and developing Bruce and Harvey's relationship and you have a much more potent movie.

[Disposable Ninja]

I'm rooting for Clayface, myself. And I want him voiced by Ron fuckmothering Perlman.

Or Mr. Freeze. God damn yes Mr. Freeze.

EDIT:

Though Eckhart did a very, very good job portraying Dent I just didn't care that Rachel died and I think Harvey really deserved his own story and not Batman's cast-off lovers.

While I do agree about Rachel Dawes being a mistake (though that one was rectified- BA-ZING), Dark Knight very much was a story about Harvey Dent. I'd say he was more of a main character than Bruce Wayne, even. Hell, his story was basically Bruce's, only backwards.

[Brentai]

Like just about every other villain ever (though this  certainly rivals), the Animated Series did it way better, giving Harvey his own tragic fiancé and having you care not because Batman is so choked up over his poorly-written whore but because he's lost a good friend in a tragedy.

I think blowing up Rachel was a very deliberate decision in response to most peoples' reaction to her.  That and the idea that Batman had a "real-world" girlfriend waiting for him to clean everything up and come back didn't quite mesh with his whole which-is-the-mask-I-wear schtick.  Now he can boink Halle Berry without violating his character perogatives - and he can be justified doing it because the damn bitch was just gonna dump him anyway.

I like the spin of Harvey Dent being not exactly Bruce Wayne's friend, but rather a man he respected as someone with the same zeal and ability as himself, but none of the fucked-up batsuitedness.

[Arc]

Riddler and Catwoman.

Riddler is the Nolanverse villain. It allows him to play around with flashbacks, and the Riddler isn't some beast of special effects. Just imagine the virals that would come along with that motherfucker. He also provides ample opportunity to delve into the Dent cover-up, and the loose threads dangling around concerning Batman's true identity.

With Rachel gone (unless she comes back as the Phantasm oh noooooo), Catwoman and Talia make for nice additions. Kate Beckinsale has expressed interest in the Catwoman role, but she's custom made for Talia.

It'll stand up against a cat.

[Brentai]

Talia would make for some nice drama, plus you've got an excuse to bring Ra's back with his real schtick.  Can she wear a skintight leather catgirl uniform?

Riddler I do not want to see, ever again.  Whenever you see him you know that whatever Batman series you're watching just descended into camp.  Okay, TAS managed to contain the camp to within the eps actually involving Riddler, but you can't do that so cleanly with a feature-length film.

[Niku]

Riddler I do not want to see, ever again.  Whenever you see him you know that whatever Batman series you're watching just descended into camp.  Okay, TAS managed to contain the camp to within the eps actually involving Riddler, but you can't do that so cleanly with a feature-length film.

a.) Not with Dini's recently revamped Riddler who b.) doesn't have the necessary relationship built to work in the Nolanverse.  :(

[Disposable Ninja]

oh FUCK I just realized

Bring in Talia, yes, but also bring in Cassandra Cain. With Cassandra you get the best parts of the Bat Family in a relatively realistic way.